Come Out Of Her My People

[shag]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Ah and you gathered there because the Roman Catholics invented man made buildings?

Of course, why else would I

Originally Posted by Praxeas

There is no problem with having a central man made building for meetings.

Agreed.
I don't think that is really her argument tho, (the church will always gather in some type of bldg to atleast get out of the elements), but rather that the mindset of some that are convinced u have to get to the "holy ground" at the "holy bldg" so that the "mannagod" can be "Gods messenger" to you, cause u are basically considered "laity" and limited on Spiritual growth and revelation of scripture, unless it is delivered by "Gods Annointed"....and thereby that mindset can be crippling to the body from individually moving on into perfection" in personal study and prayer. When an overseer constantly carries on about getting to "Gods house" to hear what God has to say this week concerning the church...often likely tends to limit ones confidence in personally hearing from God thruout personal relationship, especially if it is not verbally encouraged from a pulpit NEARLY as much as "getting to Gods House" anytime the doors are open. And if u ever get a revelation that is contrary to what is being taught, the chances of it being sincerely heard (if conflicting)are somewhat slim. Ive heard it said plenty of times w my church, that if a pastor is in the wrong concerning scripture, its up to God to allign his thinking, not the "saints"-(laity)(not by the pastor, but by visiting ministers and platform speakers..)
I haven't read all her posts, but I'm thinking that's the jest of her intent....that type of mindset stemming from cathlocism...
Maybe I missed it tho.

[renee819]

N David wrote,

You claimed it was the RCC which brought in...church buildings

.

But you said we need to come out of buildings; said they were sins from the RCC. Which is it? This is not ridicule...it's a valid question

.

You say, "I'm not really saying that we have to abandon buildings," but your first post says just that: "And the only way that I see 'to come out of her' is to start Home Churches by those that are completely dedicated to God.

"

Either you men are completely missing the point, or buildings and the ridicule is a sidetrack to avoid the point.
No where did I say that buildings were sin. WE HAVE TO MEET IN A BUILDING, whether it is a storefront, home, restaurant, warehouse, or a so-called church building, it is a man-made building.

The point is, that Christianity, still has many of the Pagan practices that was instituted by Constantine, Rome, the RCC. Although in the early 1900's when God began pouring out His Spirit again, Pentecost could have made a fresh start. However, as an example, at first they kept the Trinity baptism, until God revealed their error to some men. And they were brave enough to come out of that popular doctrine.

When God is talking about the destruction of the Harlot Church in the end-times and He says “COME OUT OF HER MY PEOPLE” how do you men interpret that? Or did you ever consider it?
Did you ever consider that the whole structure of our method of doing church, has been handed down to us from a method foreign to the Early Church, therefore we will not get the results of the Early Church?

I believe that God is revealing to some of those that are really dedicated to do whatever it takes to obey God, to forsake Programs, building funds to build bigger and more elaborate buildings, to study the origins of holidays, etc.

And what is a person to do, when they see the fallacy of these things?

It doesn't take much study of History, to find the origins of these things.
Having lost a lot of my notes, when I changed computers, I can't quote many sources. But in my next Post I will find some things that are worth studying.

[renee819]

Originally Posted by shag

Of course, why else would I

Agreed.
I don't think that is really her argument tho, (the church will always gather in some type of bldg to atleast get out of the elements), but rather that the mindset of some that are convinced u have to get to the "holy ground" at the "holy bldg" so that the "mannagod" can be "Gods messenger" to you, cause u are basically considered "laity" and limited on Spiritual growth and revelation of scripture, unless it is delivered by "Gods Annointed"....and thereby that mindset can be crippling to the body from individually moving on into perfection" in personal study and prayer. When an overseer constantly carries on about getting to "Gods house" to hear what God has to say this week concerning the church...often likely tends to limit ones confidence in personally hearing from God thruout personal relationship, especially if it is not verbally encouraged from a pulpit NEARLY as much as "getting to Gods House" anytime the doors are open. And if u ever get a revelation that is contrary to what is being taught, the chances of it being sincerely heard (if conflicting)are somewhat slim. Ive heard it said plenty of times w my church, that if a pastor is in the wrong concerning scripture, its up to God to allign his thinking, not the "saints"-(laity)(not by the pastor, but by visiting ministers and platform speakers..)
I haven't read all her posts, but I'm thinking that's the jest of her intent....that type of mindset stemming from cathlocism...
Maybe I missed it tho.

Shag, You got the meaning of what I am saying.

[phareztamar]

This thread reminds me of animal planet...when the hyenna's surround the weak, and tear them apart.

[renee819]

SOME RESEARCH

http://www.gotquestions.org/origin-Catholic-church.html

I tried to bring some of it up but it won't copy for some reason. It isn't very long.

http://www.gadling.com/2010/09/21/th...ed-to-christi/

In the year 300 AD, Christianity was a minority religion in the Roman Empire, practiced by perhaps ten percent of the population. In good years it was discriminated against; in bad years it was persecuted. By 400 AD, a century later, it had become the official religion practiced by pretty much everyone. Evidence of this remarkable transformation can still be seen in Rome's monuments.

Teachers in Sunday schools like to tell a story about how it happened.

In the year 312 there ruled a Roman Emperor named Maxentius who had taken power illegally. He hated Christians and persecuted them. The proper heir to the throne, Constantine, marched on Rome to save the Empire. Before the two forces met in battle, Constantine saw a vision of a cross in the sky and the words "Conquer under this". Constantine and his army converted to Christianity and painted the cross on their shields. The next day they defeated the pagans and brought Christianity to Rome.

This story is almost entirely wrong, yet it has resonated down the centuries through books, paintings, and films to become part of the Christian legend.

Constantine gave one great boon to the Christians--he legalized their religion. From then on it rapidly gained more followers and began edging out the pagan cults. Soon it was the pagans being persecuted. Rioting monks trashed temples and killed pagan philosophers like Hypatia. In 382 the Altar of Victory was removed from its centuries-old home in the Senate. In 391 paganism was outlawed and temples shut all over the Empire. The old cults hung on for a few generations in rural areas, but Christianity was now the dominant power

Mithras was Christianity's main rival. As a mystery religion with its deepest teachings revealed only to the initiated, we don't know much about its inner workings. What we do know shows many similarities between Mithraism and Christianity, such as the belief that Mithras was born on December 25 to a virgin, and died and was resurrected in order to save mankind

The Pagan, virgin birth and dying son, was started at Babel.

The transition from pagan to Christian isn't always as obvious as in San Clemente. Sometimes you can see it in the art, such as the image above, a 4th century mosaic from Santa Pudenziana. Here Christ sits enthroned in a pose identical to many statues of the pagan god Jupiter. Saints Peter and Paul sit to either side dressed as Roman senators. The early Christians saw nothing wrong with this. They wanted to win the hearts and minds of the people, and a bit of reworked pagan symbolism was a good way to do that.

At times the Christians reused old buildings or parts of old buildings. San Maria Maggiore, a third century basilica, was originally a secular building before being converted into a house of worship

TO BE CONTINUED

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by renee819

Come Out Of Her My People

Let's face it. We are ruled in the churches by Pagan Christianity.
It was the Catholic Church that brought in the Trinity baptism.
The hierarchy of Clergy and Laity.
The paying of tithes.
Church buildings
And many other things.

And the only way that I see “to come out of her” is to start Home Churches by those that are completely dedicated to God.

And this makes my 3rd Sunday to a Pentecostal Church. I talked to the Pastor a few minutes after church, and told him, I didn't believe in man-made laws for the church. But we didn't have time to discuss it.

The main reason that I'm going is that I took 2 little great granddaughters with me, and now they look forward to it. Also a step grandson, age 27, that is trying to quit alcohol.
If I decide I can't go there, can I quit, and disappoint those 3?

It seems they may be pretty strict on the UPC rules, although I believe they are Independent. I told the Pastor that we, he, his wife, and I, need to set down and have a talk. But we haven't yet. Any suggestions?

Yet, if we know better.

This isn't just a suggestion, “Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.” I believe that we should forsake all the things that SHE brought in, and go strictly by the Bible.

Originally Posted by shag

Of course, why else would I



Agreed.
I don't think that is really her argument tho, (the church will always gather in some type of bldg to atleast get out of the elements), but rather that the mindset of some that are convinced u have to get to the "holy ground" at the "holy bldg" so that the "mannagod" can be "Gods messenger" to you, cause u are basically considered "laity" and limited on Spiritual growth and revelation of scripture, unless it is delivered by "Gods Annointed"....and thereby that mindset can be crippling to the body from individually moving on into perfection" in personal study and prayer. When an overseer constantly carries on about getting to "Gods house" to hear what God has to say this week concerning the church...often likely tends to limit ones confidence in personally hearing from God thruout personal relationship, especially if it is not verbally encouraged from a pulpit NEARLY as much as "getting to Gods House" anytime the doors are open. And if u ever get a revelation that is contrary to what is being taught, the chances of it being sincerely heard (if conflicting)are somewhat slim. Ive heard it said plenty of times w my church, that if a pastor is in the wrong concerning scripture, its up to God to allign his thinking, not the "saints"-(laity)(not by the pastor, but by visiting ministers and platform speakers..)
I haven't read all her posts, but I'm thinking that's the jest of her intent....that type of mindset stemming from cathlocism...
Maybe I missed it tho.

See in bold above

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by renee819

SOME RESEARCH
The Pagan, virgin birth and dying son, was started at Babel.

[renee819]

To continue,

http://www.unrv.com/culture/christianity.php

Christian Bishops under Constantine functioned in an official capacity as Imperial advisors. Tax exemptions were granted to Christian priests and money was granted from the Imperial treasury to provide for new and rebuilt churches. At a meeting of Bishops in Milan (313 AD) an edict (of Milan) was passed which essentially granted complete tolerance to all religions, but Christianity would benefit the most. Previous victims of various persecutions were also granted compensation directly from the Roman treasury. Still, however, Constantine left a confusing trail for his personal religious thoughts. Association with Sol Invictus is still cited for several more years, at least until the complete unification of the Empire

With Constantine's victory he became the sole ruler of the Roman Empire and likely feeling more secure in his position, began to advance the Christian cause more earnestly. New Churches were built in Rome and around the empire, such as the new basilica church on the Vatican hill, on the place where St. Peter had been martyred

Constantine also shifted to a somewhat hostile stance towards Pagans, as opposed to a simple supporter of Christianity. Pagan sacrifice was forbidden, and treasures of many temples were confiscated and given to Christian churches (excepting those temples dedicated to the Imperial cult). However, Constantine didn't direct aggression only against Pagans. 'Heretic' cults of dissension from the larger established Church cause problems as well. Among the most notable was the sect of Arianism which was deeply dividing the concept of Christian thought. At the Council of Nicaea in 325, in which some 300 bishops from all over the empire assembled to discuss the state of the church, important doctrines were developed to counter 'heretic' ideas. The core belief system of the Christian faith was developed, adopting the concept of the Holy Trinity as the supreme deity. This in itself may have included compromise between Bishops and Politicians, but it is perhaps more important that the Church was becoming a powerful and far reaching institution

"heretic ideas"---such as Oneness of God,

Constantine II was killed only a few years after his father, and the remaining brothers settled in to continue the advance of Christianity. During their reigns many anti-Pagan laws were put into place. Constans dealt with dissent in a particularly brutal fashion. The forcible expansion of Christianity on the populace, which was now quickly becoming a part of the every day social fabric, also brought a great of resentment from some

[houston]

Originally Posted by phareztamar

This thread reminds me of animal planet...when the hyenna's surround the weak, and tear them apart.

Drama queen

[shag]

Originally Posted by renee819

N David wrote,
.
.
"

Either you men are completely missing the point, or buildings and the ridicule is a sidetrack to avoid the point.
No where did I say that buildings were sin. WE HAVE TO MEET IN A BUILDING, whether it is a storefront, home, restaurant, warehouse, or a so-called church building, it is a man-made building.

The point is, that Christianity, still has many of the Pagan practices that was instituted by Constantine, Rome, the RCC. Although in the early 1900's when God began pouring out His Spirit again, Pentecost could have made a fresh start. However, as an example, at first they kept the Trinity baptism, until God revealed their error to some men. And they were brave enough to come out of that popular doctrine.

When God is talking about the destruction of the Harlot Church in the end-times and He says “COME OUT OF HER MY PEOPLE” how do you men interpret that? Or did you ever consider it?
Did you ever consider that the whole structure of our method of doing church, has been handed down to us from a method foreign to the Early Church, therefore we will not get the results of the Early Church?

I believe that God is revealing to some of those that are really dedicated to do whatever it takes to obey God, to forsake Programs, building funds to build bigger and more elaborate buildings, to study the origins of holidays, etc.

And what is a person to do, when they see the fallacy of these things?

It doesn't take much study of History, to find the origins of these things.
Having lost a lot of my notes, when I changed computers, I can't quote many sources. But in my next Post I will find some things that are worth studying.

Originally Posted by renee819

Come Out Of Her My People

Let's face it. We are ruled in the churches by Pagan Christianity.
It was the Catholic Church that brought in the Trinity baptism.
The hierarchy of Clergy and Laity.
The paying of tithes.
Church buildings
And many other things.

And the only way that I see “to come out of her” is to start Home Churches by those that are completely dedicated to God.

And this makes my 3rd Sunday to a Pentecostal Church. I talked to the Pastor a few minutes after church, and told him, I didn't believe in man-made laws for the church. But we didn't have time to discuss it.

The main reason that I'm going is that I took 2 little great granddaughters with me, and now they look forward to it. Also a step grandson, age 27, that is trying to quit alcohol.
If I decide I can't go there, can I quit, and disappoint those 3?

It seems they may be pretty strict on the UPC rules, although I believe they are Independent. I told the Pastor that we, he, his wife, and I, need to set down and have a talk. But we haven't yet. Any suggestions?

Yet, if we know better.

This isn't just a suggestion, “Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.” I believe that we should forsake all the things that SHE brought in, and go strictly by the Bible.

Originally Posted by Praxeas

There is no problem with having a central man made building for meetings.

Houston() we have a communication problem. Renee, I imagine it wouldve taken off a bit better if u wouldve opened up w the first bolded (latter post)first, to avoid misunderstandings....("ONLY way is home churches")