Homosexuality question

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

My response from the other thread.

I believe that we can be born with abmoralities and maladies. However, I don't believe we can be born with a sexual preference that contradicts God's Word. PMS and menopause are a natural hormonal response in a woman's body. That isn't abnormal. It isn't any more abnormal than puberty and what that entails.

Here's a link explaining how pheromones work. As you read it, keep in mind that based on blind studies, those who claimed to be homosexual neurologically responded to the pheromones of the same gender. Those who claimed to be heterosexual responded neurologically responded to pheromones from the opposite gender. This is believed to begin in our species very early, explaining why many homosexuals claim they have always been homosexual and never "chose" to be. While the mere sight and scent of my babysitter (Tammy) would send me giggling and blushing as a 3 year old... another male 3 year old child finds themselves giggling and blushing at the sight and scent of their dad's fishing buddy (Herald). lol

Everything in us contradicts Gods' Word from birth... until we are born again (Regeneration).

We have much more sickness today do to our food supply and the vaccines we put in our bodies. For instance, today, people are getting shingles - a result of the chickenpox vaccines years ago. That can mess up your body chemistry for sure. Actually, I read a link, some time back, a foreign scientist (can't recall his name) saying vaccines can change the hormonal chemistry causing some to become gay. You can check out the effects of soybean on a boy's body as well.

I'm sure you have seen the video clip with Bill Gates boldly speaking about how we can use vaccines to cut down on world population. A rich, rich man who wants to own and manage the world.

Very interesting.

You are saying that God has purposely formed and created a person into something He condemns. I don't see that as plausible nor acceptable. Having a propensity to sin because of our sinful nature is very plausible. With my fallen nature I "can become" anything I give myself over to being. As I stated, I "can become" a thief, but I wasn't born a thief.

We have people born with horrific and yes, even painful, deformities. Did God purposefully form and create a person to be disfigured and suffer, sometimes struggling for breath itself? Nope. Abnormalities happen. As you suggested they can result from drugs, maybe vaccines, various types of food... and yes... sometimes it just happens due to some fateful chromosomal combination. God isn't the author of these abnormalities. God created man in sinless perfection without any abnormality, disease, or imperfection. Again, it is sin itself that has caused us to have to endure this fallen state. And sadly, this is often made manifest from birth itself.

While we can't say that one is born a thief or a gambler... we do know that some appear to be hardwired for a predisposition towards various behaviors. For some, the levels of adrenaline and dopamine created in the brain when stealing or gambling are greater than others, thereby leaving them predisposed toward becoming habitual with regards to these behaviors more than others.

I would look more toward manmade causes for this phenomena in the body before I would look at God as the cause. I also know that some won't want that discussion as we love our doctors and our medicine. It's just that we have more hospitals and clinics than we do churches. Something has gone amiss. Someone is making the big bucks and using us as the Guinea pigs.

Again, God isn't the cause. Sin is. It has corrupted our nature. Like a computer virus that has infected and corrupted our system files, causing us to work and function differently than the way we as a species was originally designed to function.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Here's a link explaining how pheromones work. As you read it, keep in mind that based on blind studies, those who claimed to be homosexual neurologically responded to the pheromones of the same gender. Those who claimed to be heterosexual responded neurologically responded to pheromones from the opposite gender. This is believed to begin in our species very early, explaining why many homosexuals claim they have always been homosexual and never "chose" to be. While the mere sight and scent of my babysitter (Tammy) would send me giggling and blushing as a 3 year old... another male 3 year old child finds themselves giggling and blushing at the sight and scent of their dad's fishing buddy (Herald). lol

Everything in us contradicts Gods' Word from birth... until we are born again (Regeneration).




Very interesting.



We have people born with horrific and yes, even painful, deformities. Did God purposefully form and create a person to be disfigured and suffer, sometimes struggling for breath itself? Nope. Abnormalities happen. As you suggested they can result from drugs, maybe vaccines, various types of food... and yes... sometimes it just happens due to some fateful chromosomal combination. God isn't the author of these abnormalities. God created man in sinless perfection without any abnormality, disease, or imperfection. Again, it is sin itself that has caused us to have to endure this fallen state. And sadly, this is often made manifest from birth itself.

While we can't say that one is born a thief or a gambler... we do know that some appear to be hardwired for a predisposition towards various behaviors. For some, the levels of adrenaline and dopamine created in the brain when stealing or gambling are greater than others, thereby leaving them predisposed toward becoming habitual with regards to these behaviors more than others.



Again, God isn't the cause. Sin is. It has corrupted our nature. Like a computer virus that has infected and corrupted our system files, causing us to work and function differently than the way we as a species was originally designed to function.

I don't have much more to add to this discussion. In one article that I posted I agree with this statement - "a closer examination of the scientific evidence reveals that the “nature vs. nurture” debate over homosexuality is far from settled."

The author goes on to say - "At best, the evidence for a genetic and/or biological basis to homosexual orientation is inconclusive. In fact, since the early 1990s, numerous studies attempting to establish a genetic cause for homosexuality have not proven to be valid or repeatable – two important requirements for study results to become accepted as fact in the scientific community.

Because of this, the current thinking in the scientific community is that homosexuality is likely caused by a complex interaction of psychosocial, environmental and possible biological factors. And the two leading national psychiatric and psychological professional groups agree that, so far, there are no conclusive studies supporting any specific biological or genetic cause for homosexuality." (1)

(1) “Fact Sheet on Gay Lesbian Bisexual Issues,” the American Psychiatric Association, May 2000; and “American Psychological Association Online: Answers to Your Questions/Topic – Sexuality/What causes a person to have a particular sexual orientation?,” www.apa.org/topics/sorientation.html.

http://www.citizenlink.com/2010/06/1...?skip_splash=1

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don't have much more to add to this discussion. In one article that I posted I agree with this statement - "a closer examination of the scientific evidence reveals that the “nature vs. nurture” debate over homosexuality is far from settled."

The author goes on to say - "At best, the evidence for a genetic and/or biological basis to homosexual orientation is inconclusive. In fact, since the early 1990s, numerous studies attempting to establish a genetic cause for homosexuality have not proven to be valid or repeatable – two important requirements for study results to become accepted as fact in the scientific community.

Because of this, the current thinking in the scientific community is that homosexuality is likely caused by a complex interaction of psychosocial, environmental and possible biological factors. And the two leading national psychiatric and psychological professional groups agree that, so far, there are no conclusive studies supporting any specific biological or genetic cause for homosexuality." (1)

(1) “Fact Sheet on Gay Lesbian Bisexual Issues,” the American Psychiatric Association, May 2000; and “American Psychological Association Online: Answers to Your Questions/Topic – Sexuality/What causes a person to have a particular sexual orientation?,” www.apa.org/topics/sorientation.html.

http://www.citizenlink.com/2010/06/1...?skip_splash=1

I can agree with "possible biological factors". I also believe that it's not strictly genetic or biological.

Seeing this possibility, I believe it's important to assume it might be a factor when dealing with those struggling with this issue.

I mean, I'd laugh if someone told me that I had to make the choice to stop being "straight". LOL

Hmmm... I just had an interesting thought. I know that some behavioral analysts claim that most people are not 100% gay or 100% straight, but rather they are along a spectrum along the middle, but closer to either one of the preferences in question. The closer one gets to the 100% point on either end of the spectrum, obviously the less likely one will sense there is a "choice" in the matter. Could it be that those who feel it is a "choice" believe it is because indeed, for them, "they" could "choose" to be gay or straight? For the rest of us... we can't fathom the notion? LOL

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I can agree with "possible biological factors". I also believe that it's not strictly genetic or biological.

Seeing this possibility, I believe it's important to assume it might be a factor when dealing with those struggling with this issue.

I mean, I'd laugh if someone told me that I had to make the choice to stop being "straight". LOL

Hmmm... I just had an interesting thought. I know that some behavioral analysts claim that most people are not 100% gay or 100% straight, but rather they are along a spectrum along the middle, but closer to either one of the preferences in question. The closer one gets to the 100% point on either end of the spectrum, obviously the less likely one will sense there is a "choice" in the matter. Could it be that those who feel it is a "choice" believe it is because indeed, for them, "they" could "choose" to be gay or straight? For the rest of us... we can't fathom the notion? LOL

You keep pushing the point when "two leading national psychiatric and psychological professional groups agree that, so far, there are no conclusive studies supporting any specific biological or genetic cause for homosexuality."

Not much else to add to that.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I think where so many disagree is when we are confronted with the situation of one who is filled with the Spirit, loves the Lord, and is sincerely torn up and sorrowful with godly sorrow over their homosexuality... yet they either have yet to overcome it... or couldn't overcome it.

Overcoming anything is a KINGDOM matter. This involves great spiritual maturity and spiritual maturity is simply rare in our day and age. Most only get to the basics and settle into HANG-ON mode for the rest of their Christian lives. To overcome sin involves understanding of Romans 6. So it is not uncommon for believers to truly and sincerely love the Lord but not overcome something like this.

This maturity cannot come in a moment by someone laying hands on a person. It requires learning and intense renewing of the mind from the epistles.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Overcoming anything is a KINGDOM matter. This involves great spiritual maturity and spiritual maturity is simply rare in our day and age. Most only get to the basics and settle into HANG-ON mode for the rest of their Christian lives. To overcome sin involves understanding of Romans 6. So it is not uncommon for believers to truly and sincerely love the Lord but not overcome something like this.

This maturity cannot come in a moment by someone laying hands on a person. It requires learning and intense renewing of the mind from the epistles.

Should we expect to be absolutely sinless to be saved?

It's my belief that we are "sinless" and "complete" in Christ alone. All of our imperfections are hidden in Him as long as we confess our condition and depend on His grace and mercy. Of course, a Christian shouldn't be living a sinful lifestyle. One preacher once said, "While Christians aren't 'sinless', Christians should 'sin less'."

[Esther]

Originally Posted by Timmy

You are not belittling my son. You are merely claiming that he is making excuses to sin. You are merely saying he asked amiss.

So, if he never repents and does whatever else you think he has to do to be saved, will he deserve to burn in hell?

Please answer this question. Not something I didn't ask. Don't explain how he can avoid burning in hell. Don't avoid it. Don't hem and haw. Just answer it. Please.

Doesn't the Bible say NO sin shall enter there?

No repentance no entry?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Should we expect to be absolutely sinless to be saved?

Is a person physically a person if they are not mature? Of course. Lacking spiritual maturity has nothing to do with not being saved.

It's my belief that we are "sinless" and "complete" in Christ alone.

That is meant to come out in our behaviour, hence Paul spoke of sin not having dominion over us in practical manners in rom 6:12-13.

Our resurrections with Christ are meant to cause us to live overcoming lives. Our positions are those of perfection in Him. But that is still meant to work out into behaviour.

All of our imperfections are hidden in Him as long as we confess our condition and depend on His grace and mercy. Of course, a Christian shouldn't be living a sinful lifestyle. One preacher once said, "While Christians aren't 'sinless', Christians should 'sin less'."

[/quote]

I wrote a book on it called SIN LESS. It's about overcoming all through spiritual maturity in known why we arose with Him.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by houston

CJ,

What was the purpose of Calvary if everyone gets to go to heaven after this life?

If it was needful for a few, why not for the many?

[Esaias]

What if God already saved everybody he's gonna save? What if we today hear the gospel merely as a testimony against us?