Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Father?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

Bump.

My mobile doesn't show emboldened type. Please tell me which part you refer to.

[Abiding Now]

Originally Posted by mfblume

My mobile doesn't show emboldened type. Please tell me which part you refer to.

Jesus as a man had lusts.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

Jesus as a man had lusts.

Jesus prayed to not go to the cross.

Jesus was tempted... in all points like us.

He was not a man if he could not be tempted.

[Abiding Now]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Jesus prayed to not go to the cross.

Jesus was tempted... in all points like us.

He was not a man if he could not be tempted.

Easton

LUST

Sinful longing; the inward sin which leads to the falling away from God (Rom_1:21). “Lust, the origin of sin, has its place in the heart, not of necessity, but because it is the centre of all moral forces and impulses and of spiritual activity.” In Mar_4:19 “lusts” are objects of desire.


Sure doesn't sound like the Jesus I know.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Sean i quoted the Hebrew lexicon definition of the Hebrew word for tempt and it said test. Argue with the Hebrew. You actually argue with Hebrew scholars who do know Hebrew. Any thing to not admit error eh?

Admit error, I blew up your theory that God was not tempted with 4 scriptures that you seem to struggle with!



Mike you just go ahead and try to override your KJV translators all you want. The bottom line is you feel you have the right to change the words in the KJV bible as you wish.

I only recommend to folks to read their KJV Bible. Then if they have a problem with a word, go find an old dictionary if at all possible. Try to get the exact meaning of the word in question in their Bible, in its actual KJV translation, as it actually reads.

This generation simply does not agree with the KJV. That is why they "rediscover" the so called "true meanings" with "outside" sources like I see these days.(including using the FAKE translations and biased commentaries and lexicons.)

I only discuss the KJV as the true Bible....the words "God was tempted" are the true meanings.

Your problem is not with me here, it is with the KJV Bible.

How dare ANYONE, remove a word out of their KJV Bible and replace it with another word of their preference!




Psalms 78:56...
Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:

.Ps 78....Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:

Exodus 17:7 And he called the name of the place Massah, and Meribah, because of the chiding of the children of Israel, and because they tempted the LORD, saying, Is the LORD among us, or not?

N.T.(GREEK)Heb 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.


It clearly says that God was tempted...do you dare change the words you dont like?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

Easton

LUST

Sinful longing; the inward sin which leads to the falling away from God (Rom_1:21). “Lust, the origin of sin, has its place in the heart, not of necessity, but because it is the centre of all moral forces and impulses and of spiritual activity.” In Mar_4:19 “lusts” are objects of desire.


Sure doesn't sound like the Jesus I know.

there is a difference between being tempted to lust and actually lusting.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Sean

Admit error, I blew up your theory that God was not tempted with 4 scriptures that you seem to struggle with!



Mike you just go ahead and try to override your KJV translators all you want. The bottom line is you feel you have the right to change the words in the KJV bible as you wish.

I only recommend to folks to read their KJV Bible. Then if they have a problem with a word, go find an old dictionary if at all possible. Try to get the exact meaning of the word in question in their Bible, in its actual KJV translation, as it actually reads.

This generation simply does not agree with the KJV. That is why they "rediscover" the so called "true meanings" with "outside" sources like I see these days.(including using the FAKE translations and biased commentaries and lexicons.)

I only discuss the KJV as the true Bible....the words "God was tempted" are the true meanings.

Your problem is not with me here, it is with the KJV Bible.

How dare ANYONE, remove a word out of their KJV Bible and replace it with another word of their preference!




Psalms 78:56...
Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:

.Ps 78....Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:

Exodus 17:7 And he called the name of the place Massah, and Meribah, because of the chiding of the children of Israel, and because they tempted the LORD, saying, Is the LORD among us, or not?


N.T.(GREEK)Heb 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.


It clearly says that God was tempted...do you dare change the words you dont like?

Once again there is a HUGE difference between "They tested God" and "God was tempted to commit evil"

You guys are using one word that has several meanings as if it only has one meaning

ESV Psa 78:56 Yet they tested and rebelled against the Most High God and did not keep his testimonies,

KJV Psa 78:56 Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:

Thats not the same as Temptations of the flesh

Mat 26:41 Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation. The spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak."

Jas 1:12 Blessed is the man who endures temptation, because having been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him.
Jas 1:13 Let no one being tempted say, I am tempted from God. For God is not tempted by evils, and He tempts no one.
Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted by his lusts, being drawn away and seduced by them.

Testing God is not the same thing as Man being tempted by the flesh. God was not Tempted by his own flesh to sin.

Originally Posted by Sean

N.T.(GREEK)Heb 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.

That's not Greek. That's English

Tempt

peirasmós; gen. peirasmoú, masc. noun from peirázō (G3985), to make trial of, try, tempt. Trial, temptation, a putting to the test, spoken of persons only. When God is the agent, peirasmós is for the purpose of proving someone, never for the purpose of causing him to fall. If it is the devil who tempts, then it is for the purpose of causing one to fall.

(I) Generally, trial of one's character (1Pe_4:12, "to try [or prove] you"). By implication, trial of one's virtue, temptation, solicitation to sin, especially from Satan (Luk_4:13; 1Ti_6:9).

(II) Trial, temptation.
(A) A state of trial in which God brings His people through adversity and affliction in order to encourage and prove their faith and confidence in Him (Mat_6:13; Mat_26:41; Mar_14:38; Luk_8:13; Luk_11:4, "bring us not into a state of trial" [a.t.], lay not trials upon us; Luk_22:40, Luk_22:46; 1Co_10:13; Jam_1:2, Jam_1:12; 1Pe_1:6; 2Pe_2:9; Sept.: Deu_7:19; Deu_29:3). Hence used metonymically for adversity, affliction, sorrow (Luk_22:28; Act_20:19; Gal_4:14; Rev_3:10).

(B) In the opposite way, man "tempts" God by distrusting Him and complaining to Him (Heb_3:8 quoted from Psa_95:8; Sept.: Exo_17:7; Deu_9:22).


You are confusing "Being tempted to sin or do evil" with humans attempting to test God

Exo 20:20 Moses said to the people, "Do not fear, for God has come to test you, that the fear of him may be before you, that you may not sin."

Deu 6:16 "You shall not put the LORD your God to the test, as you tested him at Massah.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Once again there is a HUGE difference between "They tested God" and "God was tempted to commit evil"

You guys are using one word that has several meanings as if it only has one meaning



ESV Psa 78:56 Yet they tested and rebelled against the Most High God and did not keep his testimonies,

This is the same as this?...The ESV is a FAKE translation(different word meanings)

KJV Psa 78:56 Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:



Thats not the same as Temptations of the flesh

Mat 26:41 Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation. The spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak."

Jas 1:12 Blessed is the man who endures temptation, because having been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him.
Jas 1:13 Let no one being tempted say, I am tempted from God. For God is not tempted by evils, and He tempts no one.
Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted by his lusts, being drawn away and seduced by them.

Testing God is not the same thing as Man being tempted by the flesh. God was not Tempted by his own flesh to sin.



That's not Greek. That's English

Tempt

peirasmós; gen. peirasmoú, masc. noun from peirázō (G3985), to make trial of, try, tempt. Trial, temptation, a putting to the test, spoken of persons only. When God is the agent, peirasmós is for the purpose of proving someone, never for the purpose of causing him to fall. If it is the devil who tempts, then it is for the purpose of causing one to fall.

(I) Generally, trial of one's character (1Pe_4:12, "to try [or prove] you"). By implication, trial of one's virtue, temptation, solicitation to sin, especially from Satan (Luk_4:13; 1Ti_6:9).

(II) Trial, temptation.
(A) A state of trial in which God brings His people through adversity and affliction in order to encourage and prove their faith and confidence in Him (Mat_6:13; Mat_26:41; Mar_14:38; Luk_8:13; Luk_11:4, "bring us not into a state of trial" [a.t.], lay not trials upon us; Luk_22:40, Luk_22:46; 1Co_10:13; Jam_1:2, Jam_1:12; 1Pe_1:6; 2Pe_2:9; Sept.: Deu_7:19; Deu_29:3). Hence used metonymically for adversity, affliction, sorrow (Luk_22:28; Act_20:19; Gal_4:14; Rev_3:10).

(B) In the opposite way, man "tempts" God by distrusting Him and complaining to Him (Heb_3:8 quoted from Psa_95:8; Sept.: Exo_17:7; Deu_9:22).


You are confusing "Being tempted to sin or do evil" with humans attempting to test God

Exo 20:20 Moses said to the people, "Do not fear, for God has come to test you, that the fear of him may be before you, that you may not sin."

Deu 6:16 "You shall not put the LORD your God to the test, as you tested him at Massah.

Prax, you said all that to say the KJV translators were wrong and you and your FAKE, ESV Bible and its modern day, copyright restricted author, using FAKE GREEK, is the "more accurate" translation......

Read this folks, your faith in your Bible is under attack .....https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...78677474,d.cGU

Here is the TRUE translation, in your KJV...
Deuteronomy 6:16
16 Ye shall not tempt the Lord your God, as ye tempted him in Massah.


tempt (tmpt)
v. tempt·ed, tempt·ing, tempts
v.tr.
1. To try to get (someone) to do wrong, especially by a promise of reward.
2. To be inviting or attractive to: A second helping tempted me. We refused the offer even though it tempted us. See Synonyms at lure.
3. To provoke or to risk provoking: Don't tempt fate.
4. To cause to be strongly disposed: He was tempted to walk out.



Exodus 20:20
20 And Moses said unto the people, Fear not: for God is come to prove you, and that his fear may be before your faces, that ye sin not.

prove
pro͞ov/Submit
verb
1.
demonstrate the truth or existence of (something) by evidence or argument.
"the concept is difficult to prove"
synonyms: show (to be true), demonstrate (the truth of), show beyond doubt, manifest, produce proof/evidence;



All other bibles, other than the Received Text bibles(KJV), are derived from a "counterfeit" Greek of two heretic authors...Westcott and Hort

[Aquila]

Use terms Jesus used...

John 14:7-10
7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. (KJV)

Christ clearly indicates that those who see Him, also see the Father. And then Christ explains that this is due to mutual indwelling "I am in the Father, and the Father in me".

Christ Himself explains Oneness so perfectly.

[Aquila]

What did Jesus desire that we believe?

John 10:38
38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him. (KJV)