Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias
My thoughts? I think I have something to study on this week now, lol.
If we are dead in sins, and then born of the Spirit, we are no longer dead but alive. One who was dead, and then alive, is said to have been "resurrected" are they not? Then Spirit baptism is a sort of resurrection... although I think the being made alive cannot be separated from water baptism either. Again it seems as if we today create separation where the apostles did not. We split salvation into parts and debate "what comes first and what comes next" when the apostles seem to have viewed it as a composite whole.
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I've heard the idea of splitting things when we shouldn't, but then I studied
Romans 6.
Rom 6:3-13 KJV Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? (4) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death:
Baptism is death as well as burial. This is water baptism.
[indent]...that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. [/quote]
The whole purpose of getting into His death is to walk in newness of life. AS in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. So, we GET INTO CHRIST by baptism. More specifically, we get into His death. If there was no newness of life, then baptism into Christ would be pointless.
(5) For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Here it is again. Planted int the likeness of His death is water baptism. And it seems to be saying that an automatic resurrection occurs once we've been baptized into his death. In other words, when we get into His death then we're also in his resurrection.
Like a sheet of paper put into a book, once the sheet is inside wherever the book goes the paper goes. Baptism puts us into Christ so wherever He is we are. Nothing was said here about Spirit baptism.
(6) Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Now we learn that the newness of life is a life that is not serving sin.
(7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Death frees us from sin. Since we got baptized into HIS DEATH, then we were freed from sin to enjoy this newness of life.
Now, I am strictly going by what Paul said in
Romans 6, not adding anything to it, because it's the most complete layout of the issue in the Word. Yes, we can add what else thebible says to this to make it more complete. But notice Paul has not said anything here about Spirit baptism.
(8) Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: (9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him. (10) For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Again Paul makes the case that if we've died with Him then it is automatic that we live with Him. You get the death and then you ALREADY THEREFORE HAVE THE resurrection.
I know people equate repentance with death and baptism with burial and Holy Ghost infilling as resurrection. But Paul is not doing that at all here. He said baptism is death and burial both!
(11) Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
So, without having mentioned Spirit baptism, he said once we're baptized we need to consider our selves alive from the dead with Him as well.
(12) Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
A benefit of being alive with Him is that sin does not have to rule in us any more like it did before.
(13) Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
So again, without mentioning Spirit baptism, Paul said we're alive from the dead and need to present ourselves to God with that concept about ourselves.
So, how is that splitting things up incorrectly if Paul did it, himself?
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