Love One Another and the Cross - Page 33

shazeep · #**321** 12-11-2015, 03:33 PM

Hey, i never claimed to be the example; that is what Christ is for!

"Why are you so fixated on US JUDGING if someone is saved while you are so against anyone repeating the bible's judgments on who is lost, so much so that you twist the intention and make it out as though we are judging who is lost? It's the bible doing that. Not us."

ok, well then believe me when i tell you in all love that you are lost anda goin' ta hail if you don't change your mind! And i can prove it with Scripture!

it's the Bible, it isn't me!

Judge not, or you will be judged.

shazeep · #**322** 12-11-2015, 05:01 PM

hopefully the point is made that formulas for Scriptural judgement by humans are ultimately self-serving, and irrelevant.

mfblume · #**323** 12-11-2015, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

hopefully the point is made that formulas for Scriptural judgement by humans are ultimately self-serving, and irrelevant.

You only proved disdain for the blood remitting sins. And dishonesty in discussing by ignoring what I said.

shazeep · #**324** 12-12-2015, 07:31 AM

well, let's admit that you've done some ignoring yourself. And you have no shown any disdain on my part; i have repeatedly said that love will get you closer to Christ, not further. A different understanding, to be sure; one from the heart.

Dogma comes through a filter. It does no good to say "They are all lost" if God does not operate that way; and no one considering the whole of Scripture would ever have the temerity to say that--yet it is a commonly held doctrine among us. I persisted here, and maybe got a little personal--sorry--to show that OPs don't even believe their own dogma.

You did better than anyone else ever has, btw, but Scripture is made to uncover hypocrisy. It is all well and good to say you believe in Christ, have faith in Christ; but don't ignore that many will cry "Lord." If faith in an Acts 2:38 experience saves you, then either you are saved, OSAS, or you are not, and either works play a part or they do not, in one's salvation.

As you know, i could go on in this vein. We have several parables that clarify these issues. The Holy Spirit should be one's guide; we read that no intermediary is required, or desired--we already have a perfect One. When you approach Christ through Love, it all falls into place; when you don't, a whole host of evils, "They are all lost, we are all saved, fear evil, not God, They are coming to get us, I am here to condemn others with Scripture," on and on, become not only possible, but will happen. Your worst nightmares will come true.

mfblume · #**325** 12-12-2015, 08:30 AM

Of course love gets you close to God. But the greater love is God providing remission of sins through the cross. Like Paul, we need to know nothing in contrast to Christ and him crucified. While you focus on human love without the touch of God, true greater love overshadows that, works through us, from the standpoint of the cross first and absolutely foremost. All other love is secondary and sometimes even perverse and fake

Human love never made the first step nor can. It was marred. But God's love is always the issue. Get your eyes off self.

No greater love. It all begins at the cross. Not our crosses we carry either. His cross. It's a gift. Can be tossed aside or it would not even be actual love. Freely given, but ours to hold or toss. It does not twist another's words. It doesn't compromise after it says the cross is the only way, and does not make exceptions when it accuses those who deny the Son to be antichrist.

It's beyond earning salvation through he most noble efforts of Human love that are filthy garments by comparison.

It doesn't take crying "Lord Lord" out of context but maintains the word is to be heard and done after the message of the cross and revelation of Christ as Son and Lord is accepted. It begins with seeing him as Lord and cannot be seen aside from the revelation He is Son. But just as casting out devils is good as well as prophesying in his name and doing wonders, awareness of His Son ship, and hence Lordship, is only the start. It's useless without following thst with our crosses. But without his cross before our crosses those who try carrying their crosses are thieves and robbers and try gong on through some delusional self righteousness and human love vaunting self up as God.

Simply put you need to learn the word, stop making up your own path apart from His, and get back to the cross of Christ rather than your self redeeming bloodless cross. Satan doesn't mind kindness and love if it's apart from Christ's sin remitting cross, for that self righteous love is really filthy rags compared to the love of God he actually grants to us before we get a chance to love anyone. It's so holy and superior that allowing us to use our love before his, to earn his, actually diminishes it's purity.

It's so simple it lays out truth clearly enough that a child can read denial of the Son makes one antichrist, and clearly see the glory of the Son, without the "deeper" wrestling if it to make those who plainly reject the existence of the Son to somehow be carrying their crosses and following God better than one who points to the cross first and our crosses second.

Keep trying to create your own way. The only one is narrow. Self exaltant human love is too susceptible to satanic deception so long as the cross of his work where his blood is shed to remit sins is traded for it.

You got so offended you tossed his cross and made yourself saviour, and judge og what his words mean. The enemy succeeed in seeing you take the very words that reveal truth and use it to condemn those who have it, and make those it plainly calls antichrist into true believers instead. What a deception.

If you darkness is light how dark must that darkness be?

mfblume · #**326** 12-12-2015, 09:12 AM

I never saw such elaborate creations of self serving dogma that stem from three simple mistakes.

1) demand saying people are lost who don't know Christ as a son of God, and reject the cross as the only redeeming work of any kind, and only done by God, means one is not loving.

2) confusing the reference to doctrine of Christ, that's not laid out in 2 John, as being the commandment to love, that's mentioned earlier.

3) failing to realize the bible condemns those who reject Christ as Son and the cross as way for remission of sins, and we're meant to relay that information.

Oh and one more....

Lol.

4) You actually think I confront sinners and tell them, "hey, you're lost and I can prove it with bible. "

KeptByTheWord · #**327** 12-12-2015, 09:46 AM

It is hard for humanity to understand a God who loves us so much, yet holds us accountable for the things we do. The two don't seem to "match" in our human understanding. Either he is a loving God who loves us no matter what we do, or He is a hateful judging God who is just looking for a chance to condemn us. Those two are polar opposites, and yet... in reality... God is a loving God who is also a God of judgment. The two do meet, and cannot be separated.

Through the cross we have been offered the greatest mercy and love ever known to humanity... and because of that great offering, there is an expectation of judgment if that offering of love is rejected.

Shazeep... while you preach love is the greatest that there is, that indeed is true. But without understanding that with that great love comes the expectation of judgment if that love is spurned... then this is where you are failing. The great love took place at the cross... and if you truly love someone you will tell them the truth, and not lie to them.

The only hope for humanity is at the cross, accepting the gift of love offered to us there, and continuing our lives with the cross, and the blood of Jesus ever before us, and knowing that a certain judgment awaits us if we spurn, and turn away from the gift offered to us.

The God of love and the God of judgement are not two different entities, they are one and the same, and cannot be separated.