Are all Catholics lost?

[shazeep]

Fulfilling the law simply means it's what the law demanded and it is accomplished.

what does "it is accomplished" mean here? i'm not quite following, rephrase this if you would.

No one can be saved by law,

well, the correct way to refute this would be to start by restating it correctly, wadr, so this should be "No one can be saved by fulfilling the law," which is not the same thing, even though you are of course going to have to keep insisting that it is. So you might take the day to shop this around to your peers, and see what kind of opinion may be had on it, because i suggest to you that this phrase,

"No one can be saved by fulfilling the law,"

is exactly, 180 degrees, away from how God characterizes those who "fulfill the law," and i can "prove" it, almost surely probably.

[mfblume]

The good things Christians must do, and refraining from sins the bible listed, do not earn Heaven for us. Only one good deed paid for us to go to Heaven. Jesus' work of the cross.

You can stack a million good deeds on one side of the scale, and one sin on the other. You can balance them out. You can imbalance them any way., Neither result will ever get you to heaven. Only the death of Jesus in your place, with your faith completely in it, will ever get you to heaven.

Good deeds are simply what Christians should do. But they don't take us to heaven.

[shazeep]

that's ok imo, because there is no place called Heaven, and your explanation does not negate that i, along with the Good Samaritan, do not have to agree with your model of salvation in order to be considered accepted by God. You assume a mandate, but explain away the one clearly provided, by forcing a conflation with good deeds, which are not even mentioned.

the question to you was can you separate "fulfills the law" from salvation, as i am convinced that i can show the two to be equal.

[mfblume]

Lol. Never getting the point. Going to heaven equals being saved.

And there is a place.

Mark 16: 19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

But now we have no heaven, good works saved us, carry the cross without Jesus even considered as saving us by the cross he carried and died on, and likely no hell either. Very biblical! Lol

Gotcha!

[shazeep]

but you know that that is not what i meant, and i have verses that support me, too. My chief observation here is that the subject gets changed, it seems in order to avoid a direct answer. A man who fulfills the law will judge those who have the letter of the law, imo.

[Evang.Benincasa]

How many pages does it take to just say all Catholics are lost?

I guess a lot?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

How many pages does it take to just say all Catholics are lost?

I guess a lot?

ah guess you dint notice the results.

A man who fulfills the law will judge those who have the letter of the law

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by shazeep

ah guess you dint notice the results

I sure did notice the results.

Catholics are still lost.

You are a sore loser.

And every time a bell rings an angel gets its wings?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by shazeep

that's ok imo, because there is no place called Heaven, and your explanation does not negate that i, along with the Good Samaritan, do not have to agree with your model of salvation in order to be considered accepted by God. You assume a mandate, but explain away the one clearly provided, by forcing a conflation with good deeds, which are not even mentioned.

the question to you was can you separate "fulfills the law" from salvation, as i am convinced that i can show the two to be equal.

It's not my model. It's what the Lord and apostles taught. The good samaritan was not saved by the works he did. That lesson is not there to show how to be saved, for the umpteenth time. lol. It's there to coincide with everything else the bible says about being good to people since it's profitable to men.

You haven't shown anything thus far, just generalized conclusions. Fulfilling the law is not salvation, because....

Galatians 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Romans 9:32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

Twist anything you wish, but you'll come good for it. Fulfilling the law is not being saved. It's... just fulfilling the law. lol

Good deeds are not even mentioned? What do you think one does in obedience to law if not good deeds? Law is synonymous with good deeds. Why do you think the word WORKS is associated with Law throughout the bible?

I've conclude some folks simply don't read the bible to learn anything, but find what they already believe, resulting in wresting of the scriptures. This has been by far the worst case I ever personally witnessed.... man, it's the search for one's own philosophy in the word..... on steroids. And it's utterly antichrist!

No death of Christ on the cross is needed Goes right along with the Koran's version of Christ, but against the Bible's version of Christ. You done got yourself another Jesus.

[shazeep]

thing is, that is just your opinion, and i am the one quoting Christ. Well, before, not with

A man who fulfills the law will judge those who have the letter of the law.

but i guess we are going to avoid this one like the plague now too. ok.