Christians persecuted during the Trib are blessed

[Originalist]

A teaching circulating on AFF states that allowing his saints to suffer physical persecution during the Tribulation would amount to Christ terrorizing his bride.

But what does the Bible say about these suffering and sometimes martyred heroes?

12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them. (Revelation 14:12-13)

These people are not counted as weak, defeated and forsaken by God. Rather, they are called BLESSED ! They are not found going "limp as wet noodles" in the slightest. They are overcoming Satan by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony.

As saints and those holding to the testimony of Jesus, they will not be among those hiding in the caves from the wrath of the Lamb as depicted in Revelation 6 (which is actually depicting what happens in Matthew 24-29-31). These are saints who are not objects of God's wrath and thus do not fear it.

The insane misrepresentation of the Post-Trib position being promoted by a false teacher on this board is found to be extremely self-contradictory. On the one hand, the false teaching declares that the persecution of the Tribulation is a result of being left behind at the so-called "pre-trib rapture" and that the saints could never endure it. Yet, the false teacher, while quoting Revelation 14:12-13, completely misses the fact that the "left behind Tribulation saints" are facing this test of their faith with valor and boldness, being referred to as BLESSED! How could these left-behind, second-class Christians be found able to endure that which the "pre-Tribulation , already raptured bride" could not?

The person teaching this nonsense need not try to be a teacher as he/she has not learned the basic laws of biblical interpretation.

Furthermore, the false teacher compares the Tribulation to the time of Noah's flood. This is another example of poor hermeneutics. The flood was wrath. It destroyed the entire population of the planet minus 8 souls. The "Tribulation", which begins 3-1/2 years into the last 7 years, and lasts right at 3-1/2 years, is primarily that....TRIBULATION for the Saints. Sure, there will be some judgments as well. But what Jesus likened unto the "Days of Noah" was NOT the Tribulation, but the coming of the Son of Man as Christ depicted in Matthew 24-29-31, the ONLY coming taught by Christ in Matthew 24. That coming will bring with it the same kind of swift annihilation that the flood of Noah brought. A scant few will survive and remain to be ruled by Christ and the Saints in the 1000 year reign. When Christ returns as depicted in Matthew 24:29-31, saints having passed through the Tribulation will be being changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, rising to meet their Lord in the air.

False teachers and prophets should not be afforded the courtesy of a direct reply. We must do what the Bible says and not even bid them Godspeed.

[Sean]

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?



Good luck standing against the wrath of almighty God, my post trib brethren.

I suggest buying property in the mountains to hide.

Every person is listed here.

Scary stuff.

[Sean]

....better hope that preterists are right and Rev. happened 2000 years ago, because post tribbers are in for some big time trouble, never seen since the beginning of the world or ever will be.


Wherefore, attempt to comfort yourselves with your doctrine.

[Originalist]

As all can see, false teachers simply ignore passages that contradict their false doctrine. If their self-contradiction is pointed out, they simply ignore it and double-down on their lies. False teachers often have this trait of an ego-maniac. Ego is more important than truth. Those who reject their teachings are rejecting them (in their minds), so they lash out with more false-doctrine. It is better to never address them directly as this is the type of attention they crave. Rather, point out the error of their teaching and ignore the ego, letting it starve.

[Sean]

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a shout of command, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first....17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.



Revelation 4King James Version (KJV)

4 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.



(Here)After the trumpet sounds.

[Sean]

Funny(interesting) how the 7 churches disappear out of earthly view after chapter 3.

[jediwill83]

1 Coronthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the LAST trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by jediwill83

1 Coronthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the LAST trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

So simple. So beautiful. So uncomplicated. Just let scripture interpret scripture.

God with them until the end, giving them grace to endure martyrdom, as he did Stephen.

[Originalist]

The Tribulation saints will overcome the enemy by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony!

[Michael The Disciple]

Yet, the false teacher, while quoting Revelation 14:12-13, completely misses the fact that the "left behind Tribulation saints" are facing this test of their faith with valor and boldness, being referred to as BLESSED! How could these left-behind, second-class Christians be found able to endure that which the "pre-Tribulation , already raptured bride" could not?

Yes this destroys the "wife beater" type concept the modern day pre tribbers have come up with.

Its very crucial to understand the case of the 144 thousand. They are in the midst of the wrath of God being poured out on Earth. Yet they are SEALED against it. Gods wrath will not touch them.

These God is able to bless and keep from his wrath and even satans wrath (according as his will may be) even tho his wrath is falling on others.

And pre tribs accept this for the "bottom tier" type left behind Christians they believe in but reject the idea God could do the same for his end time overcomers!


The whole concept of the wrath of God gets misunderstood when people forget there are DEGREES of the wrath of God. It is on some right now. He can bring wrath against who he pleases any time.

In the days of Paul he said the wrath of God had come on the Jews TO THE UTTERMOST! 1 Thess 2:15-16.

15Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: 16Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.

So God was able in the first century to direct his wrath EXACTLY to whom he desired while others may not have even noticed.

I see Gods wrath coming upon the Earth, and specifically on the sinners all through the tribulation. It just gets MORE as time goes on.

And then after the sinners are killed by his wrath they will still have to face the Mighty God at the seat of judgment and be cast into the fires of Hell for their destruction.....which is then THE APEX OF HIS WRATH.