Apostoic worship??

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

We've had our disagreements, but I agree with Esaias on the ihop trance music mess. I've posted several times in various threads the connection ihop and their ilk have with catholic mysticism and new age junk. It's trash. It's connected to the occult and mysticism.

If you're offended by that, oh well.

I can't say anything about IHOP's "trance music" because I don't know what it is or what people are doing with it.

However, I do know that I've been deeply blessed through soaking prayer. I've turned on some soft worship music, laid down on my couch, folded my hands, and just focused on breathing or on a single word. I like the name of Jesus. Sometimes I love to extend it as I say it or think it, "Jeeeesus". Sometimes, it's a phrase, "I loooove you, Lord." On other occasions it's, "Hallelujah" (more like, "Haaaaleluuuujah."). Thoughts come and go. I don't try to grab them or stop them. But after some time... my mind stops reeling. It is amazing how downright NOISY our minds can become. As my mind stops buzzing with what I call background thoughts, or "static", I begin to feel a very deep calm. Soon, you actually get to sense what it is to just... "be". And while just "being" you also begin to realize the joy with just "being" with God in that very moment. You realize, the present moment is all that matters. Not what happened yesterday, or what you think will happen tomorrow. Now. The present moment. It's almost shocking how much of our mind is either focused on what has happened in the past at work, in church, in our families, in our marriages... or what we think will happen in the future at work, in church, in our families, or in our marriages. I don't know about others, but I found that I was spending nearly 80% of my thought life either in the past, the future, or some mindless pursuit like Facebook. Very rarely was I ever just in the... now.

At that moment, the calm is serene. You "feel" God so strongly enveloping you. It's like when you just hold someone you love, or when they just hold you. No words need to be said. Just being held is all that matters, and is all that is necessary. In fact, words wouldn't add a thing to the experience. They would only cheapen it. And as you end your time of soaking prayer and go about your day, that sense of His presence lingers. Sometimes, I've fallen asleep. lol But it is one of the most restful naps I have ever felt. Sometimes it is as though you are made more aware of His presence in the now. And sometimes it is almost as though He were radio active (for lack of a better word), His presence lingering on you from your embrace like some fine fragrance.

The funny thing is, I've seen this very same thing in prayer rooms all my life. In churches, at conferences, etc. It's just nobody called it "soaking" prayer. But we're like fearful sheep. Somebody dares to coin a phrase to help draw distinction to an element of understanding and we all freak out and start lobbing heresy accusations. Good grief. So what? Someone has decided to call it "soaking prayer". What, are we to forbid just soaking in God's presence? Would it be more permissible if we called it prostrate in God's presence, "prostration prayer"? Or what if we called it, "Basking Prayer"??? LOL

Regardless of what one wishes to call it, it has been in Pentecost for generations.

And trances... my goodness. My first pastor, Rev. Huss Shearer, taught on "trances". If you've ever experienced a trance, you'd know that a trance is "the crossroads where visions are experienced". He pulled from this passage:

Acts 10:9-11 King James Version (KJV)
9 On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10 And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11 And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:

My goodness, that was an awesome sermon. Pastor Shearer encouraged us to unplug the telephone, go into our closets and lock the door, and seek the presence of God until we too experienced a, "trance". He explained that it is there where we can hear, firsthand, the voice of God, receive visions, and revelations.

Look, all "soaking prayer" is, is the practice of silencing the mind enough to simply enjoy and experience the "presence" of God. I've often said when I get to Heaven, I'm going to probably just lay at Jesus' feet for 10,000 years or so, just enjoying the fact that He's right there. Dear God, some of y'all would have me thrown out of Heaven for that, because that's a form of soaking prayer. LOL In the King James Bible, entering the presence of God and praying until you silence the mind to receive from Him is called, a "trance". Oh, and "contemplative prayer", all that is, is focusing on a truth, verse, phrase, name, or teaching of Scripture... while soaking in God's presence... until you understand it more fully, personally, or unlock deeper dimensions of its reality to apply to your own life. In the King James, they call this, "meditation".

Then there's the term, "mystic". It's based on the Greek word "μυστήριον" (mustérion). In the New Testament, it is the counsels of God, once hidden but now revealed in the Gospel or some fact concerning it. It is the Christian revelation generally, or particular truths or details of the Christian revelation. Those who intermeddleth (Proverbs 18:1) with the "mustérion", are called, "mystics". The "mystics" of old were known to experience spiritual ecstasy, trances, unintelligible utterances, visions, angelic visitations, etc., and they were openly called "mystics" by the historical church. Some of these individuals were even considered "Saints" worthy of veneration by the Catholic and Orthodox churches. But that's only half the story. Most were considered eccentrics, heretics, blasphemers, and occultists when they were alive...and so they were often persecuted and rejected by their contemporary "theologians". However, they are regarded as great men and women of faith today by those who persecuted them. If you are able to read between the lines, many of the so called "mystics" experienced experiences similar to what we call the "baptism of the Holy Ghost", today. It doesn't take one long to realize that many of these look very much like they were the "Pentecostals" of the Middle Ages. In fact, if you could time travel and bring many of these "mystics" to the present, they'd understand the nature of the utterances, prophesies, interpretations, visions, etc. that are common in our Pentecostal churches more than they would the boring and lifeless liturgy of most Catholic churches today. Personally, I think that we Pentecostals are the "mystics" of the hour.

But there is a problem. Modern Christians function more on fear than experience. They'd rather curse the unknown depths of the Holy Spirit than dive in. It justifies their "fear" and "insecurity" with stepping out of their comfortable little boat and onto the water to supernaturally walk with Jesus. They hear terms like "contemplative" and act like frightened rabbits. Or they hear terms like "soaking" or "mystic" or "trance" and totally freak out. Bro... those terms, and/or their meanings, are recorded in the King James Bible. They are older than the New Age movement. In fact, Christians being called "mystics" on account of their spiritual experiences while in prayer predates the New Age use of the term by almost a thousand years. The King James Bible used the word "trance" hundreds of years before the Transcendentalism of the mid to late 1800's.

It's almost like we've failed to realize that the New Age movement has borrowed these things from us to fill the void of its truthless stupidity. Let me tell you, if you're not a Holy Spirit filled Pentecostal today, you can never know the fullness of what a "trance" really is. You might rub a crystal and daze off into a daydream... but honey... you ain't going to get a bona fide vision from Heaven.

Then there is the treacherous reality of marketing to Christian readers...

Look, if I wrote a book titled, "The Blessing of the Trance" (based on how the word "trance" is used in the King James Bible), you and I know that most Christians would freak out and start throwing garlic, wooden crosses, and silver bullets at me. But if I titled it, "The Blessing of Soaking Prayer", they might be more inclined to read what I'm trying to share. Or if I wrote a book, "The Joys of Christian Meditation" (as the term "meditation" is used in the King James Bible), some overly excited self appointed heresy hunter would claim that I'm teaching Buddhism. But if I call it, "The Joys of Contemplative Prayer", more folks might be willing to read what I have to say and give it a chance. Frankly, I think it is a shame that Christian authors have to re-word things just to try to open people up to looking into long forgotten Christian practices that are found in Scripture.

Then you have the detractors. They are mostly stuffy old Calvinists who believe that speaking in tongues is the Kundalini spirit. They will curse and condemn any spiritual practice that opens one up to personally experience God or the supernatural realities experienced by men and women throughout the Scriptures. And they make MONEY by writing books condemning Pentecostals, Charismatics, Mystics, trances, meditation, soaking prayer, contemplative prayer, faith healing, visions, etc. Let me ask you this... why are PENTECOSTALS taking their queues from these losers??? LOL

Have you noticed a disinterest in personal spiritual experiences, gifts of the Spirit, visions, etc. within Pentecost? I have. We're listening to all these "respectable" Reformed theologians... and ceasing to be Spirit Filled Pentecostals who are on the cutting edge of the move of God, that walk in the supernatural, and challenge dead and lifeless religion. We're losing the power and trading it in for their Reformed "intellectualism" and "systematic theology". Monergism is already starting to make it's way into our camp. Monergism is a real devil. It's certainly more dangerous than "soaking prayer". But you'll be respected for caving in and believing monergism. But you catch fire from all sides if you seek to prayerfully "soak" in God's presence? Something is wrong. Something is backwards.

We need to start focusing on digging into the Holy Spirit and the supernatural realities in this thing... or we'll one day be nothing more than a spiritually lifeless pseudo-Calvinistic bunch of condemnatory heresy hunters.

Remember, we're Apostolic Pentecostals. The supernatural and spiritual realities of the Bible should be our specialty.