Demons and the believer

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The point is that while some would like to totally politicize the Gospel into strictly a socio-political movement to "Christianize" a culture... biblical Christianity is spiritual. We see more in Scripture involving salvation, miracles, healing, and deliverance from demonic spirits than we do efforts to "Christianize" Rome. And historically speaking, we see where that understanding took us. Enter... the Holy Roman Empire.

Keep the church pure (opposing antichrist imaginations).
Oppose demonic forces (engaging demonic spirits in spiritual warfare).

It's actually that simple.

The point is to change the world by preaching the gospel and confronting sin in our culture.
The HRE was a result of Constantine adopting and paganizing an adulterated form of "Christianity" which was/is in reality Mystery Babylon.

[Apostolic1ness]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The point is that while some would like to totally politicize the Gospel into strictly a socio-political movement to "Christianize" a culture... biblical Christianity is spiritual. We see more in Scripture involving salvation, miracles, healing, and deliverance from demonic spirits than we do efforts to "Christianize" Rome. And historically speaking, we see where that understanding took us. Enter... the Holy Roman Empire.

Keep the church pure (opposing antichrist imaginations).
Oppose demonic forces (engaging demonic spirits in spiritual warfare).

It's actually that simple.

can you give an example of how one engages demonic spirits?

[berkeley]

Originally Posted by Esaias

What's simple is that you are THE.LAST.PERSON anyone needs to be taking advice from on spiritual matters:

I guess I missed that post. Wow.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

What's simple is that you are THE.LAST.PERSON anyone needs to be taking advice from on spiritual matters:

I was able to identify a spiritual pattern similar to Hinduism in two of the UPCI churches I used to attend. And, that is a bad thing, why?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Amanah

The point is to change the world by preaching the gospel and confronting sin in our culture.
The HRE was a result of Constantine adopting and paganizing an adulterated form of "Christianity" which was/is in reality Mystery Babylon.

The church will never change the world. The world is the world. It will always be the world, until Christ returns. We do better to confront sin in our lives and encourage others to confront sin in their own. Only individuals can be saved. Cultures, nations, systems, political parties, etc., are all going to burn and thrown on the ash heap of history one day.

Think about the focus. Christianity is becoming so focused on changing the culture, it is lacking personal spiritual depth and experience. And sadly, one within the system can't see it. We are a Kingdom. It's already established. It is eternal. We were never promised to be the majority opinion on earth. We were never promised social victory, political glory, or political power. We're a remnant people. The world does its thing. We do ours.

Does the focus on culture, politics, etc. bring stress, anxiety, fear or foreboding about the future? I see saints that are so emotionally and spiritually exhausted from the shock-jock culture preachers, that they seem to have no transcendent joy, or spirituality. One told me the other day, "Brother, we're losing the culture war."

Thank about that.

We're losing a war... we were never called to fight.
We're losing a war... when we were told the gates of Hell cannot prevail against the church.

They don't know or understand the Kingdom. We are (present tense) more than conquerors. I'm not all caught up in or bothered by what the world is doing. They've always been vile and godless. And they will continue to be until Christ returns. We're to preach Jesus. They are the mission field. They are who we are called love and to reach. We are called to touch lives. To help others in their spiritual journey to wholeness and joy. A joy that isn't predicated upon anything in this world. Not all will come. But a few will.

I wish I had piped up and told my dear brother that we weren't losing a culture war. The culture has always been vile and evil and we were never told that we'd put an end to that. We're a spiritual Kingdom, and that Kingdom is already victorious. And those who come aboard will partake in that very same joyous victory.

People seem to be panicked. They say, "Look at all the gay marriage, look at all the abortion, look at all the lies, look at all the greed, look at all the godlessness, look at all....", and they could go on and on. I'm over here like, "Praise God none of that can be found within the Kingdom I'm a part of. There is nothing but unending peace, joy, and goodness in this Kingdom."

Don't look at all the issues in the world. I promise you, the world will only get worse. All these issues have been here since the fall, and they'll be here until Christ returns.

Focus on Jesus.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by berkeley

I guess I missed that post. Wow.

Wow. Indeed, he for real "waxed a elephant" a couple pages back, I had to skim through that. But Esaais apparently was able to read all that, a brave man! Lol

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Titus 3:1 Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work,

Esaias, I should have filtered my response to you. I have high regard and respect for your knowledge of the bible, your intelligence, and sincere love of God.


BUT not every time we read "principalities, powers" does it necessarily refer to human powers.

Have you read "God at War" by Greg Boyd?

In chapter 10, beginning on page 270, Boyd presents "The New Testament's conception of the Demonic Realm". First he gives NT references to Satan, then:

"The many references to lesser demonic figures follow the same pattern. As in the Gospels, they are often referred to simply as demons (Rom 8:38; 1 Cor 10:20-21; 1 Tim 4:1; Jas 2:19; Rev 9:20, 16:14; 18:2). Other times they are referred to as messengers or angels (Rom 8:38; 1 Cor 6:3; 11:10?; 2 Cor 12:7; Gal 1:8; Col 2:18; 1 Pet 3:22; Jude 6; Rev 12:7,9).

Still other times, especially in Paul, we find superhuman beings, some good and some evil, referred to in more esoteric apocalyptic terminology. Hence Paul sometimes refers to what appear to be high-level angelic beings as archai or archontes("rulers" or "principalities", Rom 8:38; 1 Cor 2:6, 8; 15:24; Eph 1:21; 3:10; 6:12; Col 1:16; 2:10, 15), and to still other classes of heavenly beings with the terms kyriotetos ("dominions," Eph 1:21, Col 1:16), kosmokratores("cosmic powers," Eph 6:12), thronoi("thrones," Col 1:16) and pneumatika ("spiritual forces," Eph 6:12). Finally, he is in all probability referring to something akin to "angels of nature" with the phrase stoicheia tou kosmou ("elemental spirits of the universe," Col 2:8, 20; Gal 4:3, 8-9)."

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Apostolic1ness

can you give an example of how one engages demonic spirits?

By command. We command them.

When we issue a command and loose the power and authority of Jesus, they must go. The spoke word is powerful. More powerful than we realize.

Jesus conquered death and spoiled all the principalities and powers of darkness. Spiritual warfare is necessary because Satan’s will is set against God’s will, and our fighting as the church is to subdue the satanic will and defeat God’s enemy in the lives of seeking souls. In the spiritual warfare arena the most important thing is being in the right position: we fight not from an earthly position but from the position of ascension, as from the heavenlies, as one with Christ. We must identify ourselves as "in Christ".

In spiritual warfare one must maintain a balance through discernment. Jesus sometimes cast demons out of people; other times He healed people with no mention of the demonic. We must not "assume" that everything we encounter is demonic. We must pray for the gift of discernment and properly discern when we truly face demonic spiritual forces in our lives and the lives of others.

Spiritual warfare is one area of Christian prayer and practice that isn't designed to be quiet. In fact, one must understand and employ the power of the spoken word. The ancients understood this. In fact, the Bible states that there is power in the spoken word:

Proverbs 18:21
“Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and those who love it will eat its fruits.”

Proverbs 12:18
“There is one whose rash words are like sword thrusts, but the tongue of the wise brings healing.”

The Bible begins with a demonstration of the power of the spoken word. God speaks, "Let there be light", and there was light (Genesis 1:3). God created mankind in His image and likeness, meaning (among many things) that man had the ability to reason and... speak.

Think about it. When one considers every living thing on earth... only man has the ability to actually "speak". Words begin as thoughts, notions, and ideas. They begin as immaterial things in the very soul of a man. And when those things are contemplated, they stimulate matter, the very cells of the brain. How else do they effect matter (the natural world)? Through exhalation, with the assistance of our vocal cords, we form our thought on the very air we breath in the form of vibrations. Those vibrations are received through the anatomy of the ear and these vibrations transfer that very thought into the minds of those who hear us, stimulating their brains, their souls. This is the very power of creation itself.

This analogy is something I tend to refer back to, forgive me if it is repetitious. If I were standing before you and said, "Red ball", almost instantly the image of a red ball would appear in your mind. I just moved my thought into your very mind. I created something...in your soul. And it forever becomes a part of you through memory. And so we see the power of the spoken word. (Please remember this principle, it will be very important towards the end of this post.)

But this power goes even further...

Look around you. Look at your computer. Your monitor, your keyboard, your chair, your home, your walls, your clothes, your shoes, socks, eye glasses, cup of coffee... look out your window at your car, your truck, your garage, the light posts, the electric wires, the concrete street, the sidewalks, your child's bicycle, etc. Every man made thing you lay eyes on began as what? A thought. And that thought was expressed through what? Expressed words. And those words not only entered the minds of those who heard them and/or read them, but those words shaped what those individuals would choose to do... and they helped to create our cars, trucks, houses, civil infrastructures, toys, computers, clothing, etc. Just as creation itself was formed by the spoken word, very thing man made around you began as a... "word".

Being one of the only creatures on earth capable of such expression, this boarders on the very supernatural in and of itself, though most don't realize it or contemplate it. We've become so used to it that we don't even pay any attention or heed to how truly miraculous a spoke word is. I just turned on a space heater at my desk. I didn't have to gather wood and light a fire. Because someone's ideas were expressed in words and then took on life in the minds of others, and the space heater became a reality.

But the power of the spoken word goes even further...

A word is simply an expressed thought. And thought emanates from the conscious mind. So, the source of a word is... our consciousness. Physicists have discovered something very interesting on the subatomic considering the very nature of our material reality. Everything is essentially composed of particles or waves. They decided to shoot light particles through a barrier with double slits in it and then chart how the particles passed through this double slit by hitting a second barrier. They anticipated that the light particles would show a particle pattern reflecting the slits in the first barrier. But to their absolute astonishment, they saw a wave pattern. This baffled them. Because it implies that, at some point, as each photon particle traveled through the double slit, they began to behave as waves and not particles. This would be like throwing a baseball through an open window and as it passed through the window, it became a radio wave. So, they designed a means of observing these particles as they passed through the double slit and guess what... the particles passed through the double slit and formed... a double slit particle pattern. They didn't act like waves any longer. So they tried it again without observation and guess what? They behaved like waves again! It is almost as though the tiny photons of matter knew they were being watched, and as a result, responded as expected. Why and how this happens is a mystery to physicists. But the fact reminds, the bearing of consciousness upon matter causes it to behave... as expected. This is radical! Imagine looking at a tree... and the moment you look away... it becomes nothing but waves... and when you look back in its direction... it suddenly becomes a tree again. Consciousness causes matter to behave as expected when dealing with subatomic particles. Now, this would imply that for the universe to remain a constant and not fade out of existence... something... or someone... observes all and upholds its integrity so that it might appear as... expected by that consciousness.

What physicists don't know is that the Bible has already told us this:

Hebrews 1:3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power...:

The very word, thought, mind, consciousness of Christ is what upholds the integrity of our entire reality.

When we consider this kind of power over the natural world... we see how Christ could walk on water, multiply the loaves and fishes, restore sight to the blind, and heal the lame. We see how He could calm the storm and even raise the dead. Reality itself is His to manipulate as He desires by His very thoughts!

And when physicists saw the material universe responding to our consciousness at a subatomic level... they demonstrated that even our consciousness can effect matter. I believe they unknowingly revealed that the entire universe as we know it is designed, or hardwired, to respond to... faith.

Mark 11:23
For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.

Okay, you're probably asking, "What has this to do with spiritual warfare?"

Faith desires to see the will of God be done through faith.

The very fabric of reality is designed to respond to faith. The moment something is spoken, it is given life. And yes, it can become a reality. And this is why we should guard our tongues and watch what we say, especially when in the Spirit.

We have an advantage, we know the will of God. We serve the living God. We serve the one who ultimately observes all things, upholding them by the power of His very word. And so, we know that if we ask anything according to His will... it shall be done.

This is why spiritual warfare involves the spoken word or the expression of faith. This is why spiritual warfare is not typically a matter of silent prayer. We must speak and unleash the power and authority delegated to us by Christ through faith.

And so, when we command a spirit to leave... if we have the faith to access the power and authority, we command its reality. And it must depart. The mountain must move so to speak.

TO BE CONTINUED....

[Aquila]

CONTINUED:

This brings us to another element of spiritual warfare... binding and loosing.

Matthew 16:19
And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

As it relates to spiritual warfare, "Binding" restrains evil spirits and the powers of the enemy in preparation for being cast out or cast down. "Loosing" unleashes the power of God to bring answers to prayer involving deliverance, healing, blessing, miracles, and restoration. Loosing can also be used with regards to imprecatory prayer to bring a curse of judgment against spiritual enemies, schemes, and constructs.

We had a short discussion on imprecatory prayer on another thread. Imprecatory prayers are prayers of warfare. They are prayers of declaration that involve rebukes and curses upon our spiritual enemies. For example, when Paul cursed Elymas the sorcerer with blindness. Another rather intense imprecatory prayer can be found in Psalms 140:1-13. While these prayers use much strong language, and appear to be merciless, they must be put into proper context and perspective.

First, imprecatory prayers are only even considered after all efforts to show mercy, patience, kindness, and love have been exhausted.

Second, they are not prayers of revenge, they are prayers of justice that desire to see God's will and purposes defeat the enemy and end all oppression.

Thirdly, there is an underlying desire that through such judgment one's enemies might feel the pressure and repent that they might be made right with God.

Ever pray that God "rattle the cage" or "ring the bell" of a man who opposed you in the Spirit? God has a way of knocking the man square in the head and landing him on his back. Now, if the man is wise and spiritual, he might realize that God is trying to get his attention, and that it might be best if he make his peace with the Lord. Remember, the goal of any imprecatory prayer is the salvation and well being of one's enemies. Not their destruction. Although, if God moves forward and destroys one's enemies, one can be assured that said enemy had crossed the line with God and it was time to cash in the chips.

And so, prayer for the merciless destruction of one's enemies is a sin. Jesus illustrates this when the disciples offer to pray for fire to come down and consume those who rejected Christ:

Luke 9:54-56 King James Version (KJV)
54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?
55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.
56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.

Another element of imprecatory prayer is apocalyptic language, or euphemistic language. Praying that one's enemies experience destruction, calamity, that their skulls be broken, teeth shattered, and throat slit by the sword of their own mouths isn't to be viewed as being literal. Such language can be seen in many of the imprecatory Psalms (Psalms 7, 35, 55, 58, 59, 69, 79, 109, 137 and 139). The answer to such prayers might simply be a significant set back for one's spiritual enemies. For example, the loss of a contract, a sickness, their car breaking down, the failure of their business, a work place accident, etc. We must realize that such imprecative language is symbolic and only expressing the spiritual severity of our warfare. For example, the OT prophets and Christ spoke with an imprecative prophesy of judgment against corrupt earthly nations that included the skies falling, the sun, moon, and stars being darkened, the earth being opened, and other seemingly apocalyptic language. However, these empires fell and these nations were laid waste through natural means in due time without these things literally manifesting. Such is the nature of imprecative prayer and prophecy. These prayers are simply to loose the power of God in one's defense against one's spiritual enemies, including the demonic forces that are aligned against us.

With binding and loosing prayer we will note several things:

First, the authority is granted to us here on earth.

Second, direction of action begins on earth, not in Heaven. Faith expressed through prayer begins on earth and moves Heaven (the spiritual kingdom's reality).

The battle begins with us being willing to pray and engage. We often wonder why we aren't seeing more miracles, healings, revivals, outpourings, etc. coming from God. What we fail to realize is that God is waiting for us to unleash His power through our faith and the authority given to us in Christ Jesus. Consider this... Peter didn't pray that God would heal the lame man at the gate of the temple. No. Peter prayed a declarative prayer saying, "Silver and gold have I none, but that which I do have, give I thee..." Peter understood that the power was his to unleash through the name and authority of Jesus. What Peter had was power and authority.

But sadly, we often worry about how we'll look if there aren't results. First, there will only be results if God wills it. The power is His very own Spirit. Second, this only reveals our lack of faith. Remember when I mentioned that the very fabric of the universe is designed to respond to what is expected of it? If you expect that you might fail, you invariably will. If you expect that your prayers might not be answered, they won't be. We need a new baptism of understanding that illuminates our understanding of true faith. Sometimes the failure of a prayer is in the very wording of the prayer. If I say,

"Lord, I really need a car, please bless me with a car."

What did I affirm??? I affirmed my lack. I didn't affirm God's power. But if I pray,

"Lord, I speak your blessing and power over my life. Father, I thank you for meeting my every need. I have need of wheels, oh Lord. I know you're able, and I give you all the glory, honor, thanksgiving, and praise for it. In Jesus name, Amen."

Now, what did I affirm??? God's power.

When casting out evil spirits, we must speak words of faith and power. We must bind the enemy, and loose the power of God.

I once saw my entire workplace transformed. It was like something was in the water. Everyone was on my case. Everyone seemed to have a problem with me and/or my work. The harder I tried to please, the more unpleased people were. Here's how powerful this can be. God's power always works in accordance to His will. I wasn't sure what the problem was. So, knowing how the power of God works, I simply prayed, "Father, I don't know what is necessary here, but you do. I loose your power in this place and ask that you fix what is wrong here, for you alone are able." Guess what? Within a week, I think it was only two days, everything changed and I had favor with everyone. To this day, I don't know what happened specifically. But I know the power of God went to work on my behalf.

If uncertain as to what you're up against spiritually, sometimes just releasing the power of God into the situation will allow God to go to work on your behalf, uprooting or revealing strongholds you didn't realize were present.

I know many might disagree with me. But, this is what I believe. And please understand, sometimes things are just a matter of semantics. My "methods" or understanding of spiritual principles might be worded or informed differently from another's. I might see value in what is discovered on the quantum level, and another brother might not care one bit or see how it is remotely spiritually relevant. But that doesn't mean one is right and the other is wrong. Spiritual realities and principles are vast and multifaceted. Sometimes good men can see things from different angles. It doesn't mean that they are not looking at the very same thing. They just see it differently.

[Aquila]

Regardless of the spiritual mechanics anyone believes is at work in spiritual warfare... clearly Scripture teaches us that there is indeed a demonic spiritual realm that is a reality beyond our natural awareness. Demons are confronted, bound, cast out, and people are delivered.

To say that the Gospel doesn't include this very real spiritual reality is to reduce the entire message to one of conservative political social reform, and not spiritual development, maturity, and power in the midst of a fallen and sinful world.