Interesting Trinitarian Statement - trithestic?

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Ferd

it is about time some of you stepped in and took some of the slack.

LOL, Ferd, I stepped away for awhile and it looks as if the calvary has come to the rescue while I was gone.

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

I don't agree that it's as CLEAR as you say it is

Matthew 28:18 (NKJV)

"And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of....."


The word "name" here in greek is: "onoma"

Thayer's definition of "onoma":

The name is used for everything which the name covers, everything the thought or feeling of which is aroused in the mind by mentioning, hearing, remembering, the name, i.e. for one’s rank, authority, interests, pleasure, command, excellences, deeds etc.

Having said that, we are not merely talking about a five letter name here...rather, we refer to ALL that HE, for who HE is, represents...when we speak of Father, Son and Holy Ghost, we refer to all that Jesus represents....and when we just merely refer to Jesus, we still are referring to all that HE represents...


But some would love to think that what Jesus said in Matthew 28:19 was a cryptic message for only the learned to figure out and decipher, when all along, he leads into that command showing that he was referring to the authority He possesses as demonstrated in 28:18....


So, Mizpeh, I do think it is as clearly as I suggest....

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by sola gratia

The sad thing is, none of you know the trinitarian doctrine on any real level. You know what others have told you. This is the biggest problem by and large. Fear and ostracization keep you from finding the truth on the matter.

Oh, but I'm sure you understand Oneness theology perfectly?

Social pressures keep many trinitarians from accepting biblical truths.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Oh, but I'm sure you understand Oneness theology perfectly?

Social pressures keep many trinitarians from accepting biblical truths.

I think many of them cannot let go because they then have to ask hard questions about the past like, how could all of those people have believed a lie? and when it comes to the New Birth, how could all of those people be lost?

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

I think many of them cannot let go because they then have to ask hard questions about the past like, how can all of those people have believed a lie? and when it comes to the New Birth, how can all of those people be lost?

Perhaps.

I do think Solo Boy has a very high opinion of his personal theology that may be a wee bit inflated.

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

This is a very old, yet slick, argument.

Using your worldly analogy let's consider baptism with any "incantation" uttered. For the sake of discussion, I will assume that you believe that baptism is not effecacious. I will then assume that you believe the commandment to be baptized is an important Christian rite and ordinance to be partaken of by every believer.

With that in mind, why are any words necessary at all during the baptism process? Why do trinitarians hold tightly to an "incantation" of the magical words of "Father, Son, and Holy Ghost"? I mean if the words themselves have no meaning, what's the difference?

I could say "I baptize you into the gospel". Or, "I baptize you into the body".
Truly, in your view it would not matter because there is no menaing or authority in the words or Name spoken at baptism.

Your logic is faulty at best.

Quite simply, bro...I direct you to post 102 in this thread.....

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Oh, but I'm sure you understand Oneness theology perfectly?

Social pressures keep many trinitarians from accepting biblical truths.

Some of you are trying to categorize SG ... I can tell you that he has a longer Oneness history then most of you here on AFF ...

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by J-Roc

Matthew 28:18 (NKJV)

"And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of....."


The word "name" here in greek is: "onoma"

Thayer's definition of "onoma":

The name is used for everything which the name covers, everything the thought or feeling of which is aroused in the mind by mentioning, hearing, remembering, the name, i.e. for one’s rank, authority, interests, pleasure, command, excellences, deeds etc.

Having said that, we are not merely talking about a five letter name here...rather, we refer to ALL that HE, for who HE is, represents...when we speak of Father, Son and Holy Ghost, we refer to all that Jesus represents....and when we just merely refer to Jesus, we still are referring to all that HE represents...


But some would love to think that what Jesus said in Matthew 28:19 was a cryptic message for only the learned to figure out and decipher, when all along, he leads into that command showing that he was referring to the authority He possesses as demonstrated in 28:18....


So, Mizpeh, I do think it is as clearly as I suggest....

J,

Why the problem with the mention of Jesus' name?

Do you believe baptism is necessary? Do you believe any words should be spoken over the baptized? If so, what words do you think should be spoken?

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

I preach a message sometimes called "Three Things the Devil Hates."

This is the text:


Act 5:27 And when they had brought them, they set [them] before the council: and the high priest asked them,


Act 5:28 Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.

The devil hates the Name, the Doctrine, and the Blood.

Maybe that's why I love preaching all three so much.

You folks that de-emphasize the importance of speaking that Name are aligning yourselves with the other team.

He don't like it either.

I don't think there is de-emphasis, bro...I think we're simply identifying what Jesus represents...in that regard, more emphasis is placed on Him and who He is....

[Nahum]

I care not one whit who has what history. History means nothing.

Are you still in the Word, or have you left it to follow the doctrines of men?

Trinitarianism is a false doctrine. There should be no attempt to blend New Testament theology with Catholic dogma.