How about the stance against video? When video first came out, the UPC took a stance against. That later changed. Since you are still here, apparently that change didn't bother you.
Furthermore, it is actually video capability that caused many to see the various ministry opportunities and/or enhancements opening up due to video.
It is also video capability and the allowance of such that caused many pastors, including one of my former pastors, to become concerned that things were beginning to slide down a slippery slope and there would be no stopping it.
And what about some of these "other" stances?
Like "worldly amusements" for example. The UPC took a stance against such long long ago. In writing, it has not changed. In reality, it has changed.
Same goes for professional sports which included not only sports on the adult level but organized sports in grade school - school teams. First little league was deemed as OK. Some even said it was good for kids to be involved and that they obtained valuable life experiences from it. Then it moved on to Jr. High and then to High School. Whats next? College? The NFL, NBA, etc.?
While I understand your personal issue in regards to TV and thats your choice, I have to ask, why pick on that one issue? What about these other things? Are you only UltraCon in regards to TV?
Let me get this straight....you would not submit yourself to the elected leader of our org????
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltraCon
Not for one minute would I submit to the leader of an org!
I'm more submissive than you think. I have a Pastor that I submit to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
BTW the leader of an org is not meant to be someone we submit to. We look to him for leadership to unify the collective group. But it takes more than a leader. It takes active participation and tolerance and sometimes even compromises from both sides. Each side has to remember the organization is an alliance, not a church to issue decrees...in fact who wants a church to issue decrees? Might as well go back to Rome for papal edicts
That is right but the question posed by Strongminded implied that I was somehow wrong for not submitting to the leadership of the org. I do look for the leadership to unify the collective group but I also expect that leader to do it with as much unbiased opinion as possible. I just don't think that this has been done. Like I said, I don't have any bones to pick with anybody. With or without the org we are going to have revival. If it passes and it works for you then great but our church won't be apart of it.
I've never hit a golfball. In fact i've never held a golf club.
Not to be mean...But the more you post the more I see the need to be the one to hold the door for your exit....
Bro. I admonish thee......dont hold your breath when it comes to the changes of the UPC....and things going your way.
Why does it matter to you rather I leave or not. I have no hard feelings against the UPC. I got the Holy Ghost in a UPC church my most memorable times with God have been in a UPC church. I simply disagree with where I think the org is going and for that reason I will align myself with other men and churches of the same principles that I believe and that we preach. I don't think that the RES will affect me at all. Our members don't watch TV so they'll never see the ads. I don't think we'll be any weaker becuse of us leaving. We pray a lot of people through so I don't think that's going to change. We support missions through the IAm system and not through Faith Promise so we'll continue to do that. I ask, why then should I stay and support the org?
That is right but the question posed by Strongminded implied that I was somehow wrong for not submitting to the leadership of the org. I do look for the leadership to unify the collective group but I also expect that leader to do it with as much unbiased opinion as possible. I just don't think that this has been done. Like I said, I don't have any bones to pick with anybody. With or without the org we are going to have revival. If it passes and it works for you then great but our church won't be apart of it.
But you realize to the mods and liberals what it looks like about the UCs is not that the leadership has been unbiased, but that the leadership was NOT biased enough towards the UC viewpoint in cracking down and forcing an Ultra Con agenda on everyone else. That too is never what this "United" Pentecostal Church organization was about.
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
How about the stance against video? When video first came out, the UPC took a stance against. That later changed. Since you are still here, apparently that change didn't bother you.
Furthermore, it is actually video capability that caused many to see the various ministry opportunities and/or enhancements opening up due to video.
It is also video capability and the allowance of such that caused many pastors, including one of my former pastors, to become concerned that things were beginning to slide down a slippery slope and there would be no stopping it.
And what about some of these "other" stances?
Like "worldly amusements" for example. The UPC took a stance against such long long ago. In writing, it has not changed. In reality, it has changed.
Same goes for professional sports which included not only sports on the adult level but organized sports in grade school - school teams. First little league was deemed as OK. Some even said it was good for kids to be involved and that they obtained valuable life experiences from it. Then it moved on to Jr. High and then to High School. Whats next? College? The NFL, NBA, etc.?
While I understand your personal issue in regards to TV and thats your choice, I have to ask, why pick on that one issue? What about these other things? Are you only UltraCon in regards to TV?
I feel that the UPC dropped the ball on video, it should have not allowed video in at all. Those men that were against video were right because it has become the slippery slope. If you will define "wordly amusements" then i'll most likely say we preach against it. I'm against organized sports altogether. I don't think apostolics should play or participate in organized sporting events. To the TV issue I say this: when does it stop? I have to make my mind up and say at some point it's too much and I have to leave. For me, TV is that issue. It's no different than the others but it is a position that I refuse to go into. There are lot's of things that I disapprove of in the UPC but TV is the issue that I set as a boundry and said, "if they cross this then i'm out".
:so s
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