lets see, off the top of my head? Mark 16:16 he that believes and is baptized shall be saved.
But... "he that believeth not shall be damned." It doesn't say "He that is baptized not shall be damned..." The key component necessary for salvation here is belief, not baptism. He that believeth will of course be baptized, but it is the belief in what Jesus Christ has done that saves us.
"21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a good conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ..."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferd
Gal 3:27 for as many as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
The context is again key:
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (Justified by faith, not by baptism!)
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Well, I was taught by more than one three-stepper that
forgiveness happens at repentance
but
remission, removal of sin, washing away of sin, happens at baptism if the name "Jesus" is invoked.
I too have heard a lot of "One Steppers" put it that way. There really is a broad spectrum of thought on this issue.
But... "he that believeth not shall be damned." It doesn't say "He that is baptized not shall be damned..." The key component necessary for salvation here is belief, not baptism. He that believeth will of course be baptized, but it is the belief in what Jesus Christ has done that saves us.
No one ever answered my question about this verse. How does batism save us? Well, the answer is right there in the verse:
"21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a good conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ..."
The context is again key:
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. (Justified by faith, not by baptism!)
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
LOL lets begin at the end. Nobody here believes we arent justified by faith! Can you please drop that tired argument?
next, im not trying to build a doctrine on these 3 scriptures! my point is, that YOU cannot point to a scripture that says what John 3:16 says and build a doctrine on that.
the POINT my dear friend, is that we must include it all, or we have nothing.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
I can't help but to believe that some have judged God as unmerciful, ungracious if not unfaithful to seeking souls who have truly repented but who have no light on the last remaining two steps who died faithful in all that know to do.
If a Christian, free from sin...that is, doing no sin, not practicing sin, fully repentant, has no light of the remaining two steps, please tell me how they can obey it?
I just can't picture Jesus in the same light as some of you guys project him. I reject that kind of unmerciful spirit. I do not believe it is God.
Walking in the LIGHT is the criteria for having the blood of Jesus to cleanse...continually as he is walking in the light. Not only that, he has FELLOWSHIP with Jesus, according to I Jn.
LOL lets begin at the end. Nobody here believes we arent justified by faith! Can you please drop that tired argument?
next, im not trying to build a doctrine on these 3 scriptures! my point is, that YOU cannot point to a scripture that says what John 3:16 says and build a doctrine on that.
the POINT my dear friend, is that we must include it all, or we have nothing.
Thanks. But did you catch my earlier point about the "two sides of the coin" and the fundamental paradox that exists within this discussion? In our salvation there are two apparently contradictory things happening.
1. We choose to be saved because we desire salvation (Joshua 24:15, et al.).
Notice how that even before we could make a choice, God chose us to be His children. In the verses above, the ones from Philippians through Titus emphasize that even when we could not make such a choice due to our sinful nature, God's grace intervened and He chose us for salvation.
He chose, He did the work; not just at Calvary, but the work in our hearts that made us desire Him.
Of course the other side of the coin is in #1 above: in this time, in this life, before it's too late! - we must make a decision about what we are going to do about this calling we have.
There are two ways to look at it, and to even begin to understand God's plan for us we need to look at both sides of the coin.
Thanks. But did you catch my earlier point about the "two sides of the coin" and the fundamental paradox that exists within this discussion? In our salvation there are two apparently contradictory things happening.
1. We choose to be saved because we desire salvation (Joshua 24:15, et al.).
Notice how that even before we could make a choice, God chose us to be His children. In the verses above, the ones from Philippians through Titus emphasize that even when we could not make such a choice due to our sinful nature, God's grace intervened and He chose us for salvation.
He chose, He did the work; not just at Calvary, but the work in our hearts that made us desire Him.
Of course the other side of the coin is in #1 above: in this time, in this life, before it's too late! - we must make a decision about what we are going to do about this calling we have.
There are two ways to look at it, and to even begin to understand God's plan for us we need to look at both sides of the coin.
Yes and I like your paradox. in fact, ive come close to quoting you a time or two. I think the paradox is a great position and it strikes a cord with many of these things that I see in scripture.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
That is where you and I disagree. I believe that the repenting and confessing soul is washed in the BLOOD. Jesus will NEVER fail to forgive and forget all who come to him, confessing and believing...He refuses NONE.
For you to tell the world that "YES, he refuses your contrition and confession until you are washed in the water"...minimizes the BLOOD of Jesus, to be WORTHLESS for the contrite sinner, neutralizing their faith in the blood UNTIL he is water washed. This is regretful.
Just to clarify I believe the water does nothing but provide a medium in which we are figuratively buried. The water of baptism is not holy water neither does it wash away our sins. The blood of Jesus washes away our sins and since sins are washed away when we are baptized Acts 22:16, then why is it unreasonable for me to believe the blood of Jesus Christ is sprinkled/ applied to our hearts/ consciences when we are baptized?
I believe God accepts all who come to him in confession and repentance also. It's God's goodness that leads them to repentance. I'm not saying God REFUSES someones contrition and confession until they are washed in baptism. He accepts anyone who believes in Jesus and turns from sin.
I'm not minimizing the blood of Jesus. I think the scriptures are clear the importance of baptism by the virtue of the evidence that believers were baptized IMMEDIATELY upon confession of their faith, in the middle of the night, right after Paul received his sight, the Ethiopian eunuch was baptized then and there, etc. Baptism is important because of it is for remission/forgiveness of sin and the blood of Jesus does the remitting.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Believeing, in the above passages, is the same as repenting. Mark 16 says "He that believeth..." One who believes is one whos has repented and been forgiven of his sin.
We are forgiven of our sins when we repent and God washes away our sin with His Blood just as the Bible teaches. Our first step in living for God is to be baptized in His Name, signifying to the world that the "old man" died on the altar of repentance and a new Man is bring birthed into God's Kingdom.
Actually, Bro. Sam states it better than I ever could.
__________________
"Rest in the Lord, and wait patiently for Him...." -Psa. 37:7
Waiting for the Lord is easy... Waiting patiently? Not so much.
I can't help but to believe that some have judged God as unmerciful, ungracious if not unfaithful to seeking souls who have truly repented but who have no light on the last remaining two steps who died faithful in all that know to do.
If a Christian, free from sin...that is, doing no sin, not practicing sin, fully repentant, has no light of the remaining two steps, please tell me how they can obey it?
I just can't picture Jesus in the same light as some of you guys project him. I reject that kind of unmerciful spirit. I do not believe it is God.
Walking in the LIGHT is the criteria for having the blood of Jesus to cleanse...continually as he is walking in the light. Not only that, he has FELLOWSHIP with Jesus, according to I Jn.
You continue to assert the light doctrine. Can you show it to me in the Bible?
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. 
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