* Critical News UPDATE on Tulsa*

[KarenJo]

Originally Posted by Consapostolic1

My pastor came from the upc but since the church he took over wasn't upc he had to turned his license in. Many of the people that are associated with this group are my pastors close friends. Besides they'll probably have more things to get members of the church more active such as retreats, a general conference, youth conventions, etc.

I know ministers who hold a lisc and their church may or may not follow the "standards"..the UPCI doesn't dictate at the church level...

[Whole Hearted]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

From what I am hearing, the UPC is not going to allow their licensed folks to align with the Tulsa group. I hear there are already some threats from DS's over some wanting to go to Tulsa just to windowshop the meeting.

I heard just the opposite. A good friend was at BOTT and said that an official from headquarter said that if a lic. preacher took up a fellowship card (not lic.) that they would be dropped. Now that is just what I heard.

[Thinking]

My pastor came from the upc but since the church he took over wasn't upc he had to turned his license in. Many of the people that are associated with this group are my pastors close friends. Besides they'll probably have more things to get members of the church more active such as retreats, a general conference, youth conventions, etc.

I don't understand. What was wrong with your church that the pastor had to turn in his UPC license? The church a UPC minister pastors can be either affiliated or not affiliated.

Also, the UPCI has multitudes of rallies, conferences and retreats. As far as I know most of them are open to anyone.

It's puzzling that your church could not be associated with the UPC, but it seemingly can be with the WWAF. Help me understand.

[embonpoint]

Originally Posted by Thinking

I don't understand. What was wrong with your church that the pastor had to turn in his UPC license? The church a UPC minister pastors can be either affiliated or not affiliated.

Also, the UPCI has multitudes of rallies, conferences and retreats. As far as I know most of them are open to anyone.

It's puzzling that your church could not be associated with the UPC, but it seemingly can be with the WWAF. Help me understand.

It is not hard to understand if you know much about the UPC. Your first paragraph seems to imply that there must be something wrong with the church referenced as opposed to its being caught in the political processes of the UPCI. If this was your intent without knowing the church then shame on you.

Depending on your level of cynicism there are several reasons an individual may be required to drop their license with the UPCI in order to assume the pastorate of an independent church,i.e. one not currently listed in the UPCI directory. Most places I am familar with require an individual wishing to assume such a pastorate to meet the Board of the District the church is located in, just as you would if you were starting a new HM work.Without that approval you can not pastor that church and keep your license.

Originally Posted by stmatthew

From what I am hearing, the UPC is not going to allow their licensed folks to align with the Tulsa group. I hear there are already some threats from DS's over some wanting to go to Tulsa just to windowshop the meeting.

Amazing. I've never heard anything of the sort. In fact, just the opposite from the officials in my world.

Originally Posted by Whole Hearted

I heard just the opposite. A good friend was at BOTT and said that an official from headquarter said that if a lic. preacher took up a fellowship card (not lic.) that they would be dropped. Now that is just what I heard.

Again, I've heard just the opposite.

IF... and I do mean IF... they ever tried to do that it would backfire so quick that it was stun the UPC on a level MUCH greater than those who will presently be leaving.

I know a lot of men who don't feel any need to break away from the UPC but have a great respect for the men involved in the Tulsa meeting. If... and again I do mean IF... the UPC tries to make this a 'fellowship them and your history' situation they will end up losing EASILY three times the people they would if they just coexist in arenas of fellowship.

Right now I think it's an unfortunate reality that some genuinely have a conviction that they need to realign themselves with those who believe more like them. If they turn it into an Apostolic 'Civil War' the losses will be magnified many times over. On that you can mark my words.

[stmatthew]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

From what I am hearing, the UPC is not going to allow their licensed folks to align with the Tulsa group. I hear there are already some threats from DS's over some wanting to go to Tulsa just to windowshop the meeting.

Originally Posted by Whole Hearted

I heard just the opposite. A good friend was at BOTT and said that an official from headquarter said that if a lic. preacher took up a fellowship card (not lic.) that they would be dropped. Now that is just what I heard.

If you read what I wrote, what I wrote agree's with what you wrote.

[CC1]

Originally Posted by KarenJo

I know ministers who hold a lisc and their church may or may not follow the "standards"..the UPCI doesn't dictate at the church level...

Depends on what district you are in!

[Thinking]

It is not hard to understand if you know much about the UPC. Your first paragraph seems to imply that there must be something wrong with the church referenced as opposed to its being caught in the political processes of the UPCI. If this was your intent without knowing the church then shame on you.

Please excuse me. I am not trying to cause shame--merely trying to understand this post. It's really none of my business, I suppose. Again, I'm quite sorry for the offense.

[Jekyll]

Why does everyone assume that there will be licenses issued by the Tulsa fellowship?