JEWS! - Page 2

Sept5SavedTeen · #11 02-02-2008, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Again, I think no. Sabbath is not a moral law. It is ritual.

Paul said the sabbaths are a shadow of the body, Christ. Once you have the body, you have the actuality and not a mere shadow.

The last three or four verses of Isaiah mention that we will be celebrating the Shabbat in eternity.

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Revelationist · #12 02-02-2008, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sept5SavedTeen

I'm not speaking of moral law, which we all have to keep. I'm talking about dietary law and the ceremonial law to an extent, obviously the ceremonial sacrifices are no longer necessary, but do the ceremonial laws concerning SPECIFIC obligations and commandments (mitzvots) such as keeping Shabbat or High Holy Days and other Holy Days ect. have to be kept. The NT mentions those who esteem some days and new moons and such. The Jews are told not to look down on us for not doing them, but should they be doing these things? Does GOD still have a covenant with this people?

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Zech 11:10
10 And I took my staff, even Beauty, and cut it assunder, that I might break my covenant which I had made with all the people.
KJV

That covenant has been broken... there's only one covenant now... that's the New Covenant, which is through Jesus Christ. It's for "ALL" people who don't reject it....

ManOfWord · #13 02-02-2008, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revelationist

Zech 11:10
10 And I took my staff, even Beauty, and cut it assunder, that I might break my covenant which I had made with all the people.
KJV

That covenant has been broken... there's only one covenant now... that's the New Covenant, which is through Jesus Christ. It's for "ALL" people who don't reject it....

So where in the NT does it tell us that the OT is done away with? This is a common misunderstanding in Christian circles. So, which "law" of the OT makes folks feel uncomfortable to follow?

The 10 commandments are for ALL....including the Sabbath.

Sept5SavedTeen · #14 02-02-2008, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revelationist

Zech 11:10
10 And I took my staff, even Beauty, and cut it assunder, that I might break my covenant which I had made with all the people.
KJV

That covenant has been broken... there's only one covenant now... that's the New Covenant, which is through Jesus Christ. It's for "ALL" people who don't reject it....

We should look into the context of Zec 11. I will be back later on tonight. I'm going to look into that...
Does GOD break a covenant? How? Do you believe in the "tribulation" time there'll be some scenarios that the Jews are put into by GOD? Why would you believe this? Is GOD done with the Jewish people? Ought they still be faithful to the Covenant previously made even if they believe in Christ?

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Rev · #15 02-02-2008, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sept5SavedTeen

The last three or four verses of Isaiah mention that we will be celebrating the Shabbat in eternity.

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

(Isa 66:22) For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
(Isa 66:23) And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

Falla39 · #16 02-02-2008, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sept5SavedTeen

Ok, we all love them, they're great. The question is this; if a Jew converts to Christianity do they still need to keep the Law? The reason I ask this- I obviously don't have to worry about keeping sabbath or kosher or anything like that. GOD has never told us in the New Covenant to keep it and GOD never told my people to keep these things, because I am not Jewish. However, for a Jew, GOD DID tell them to keep sabbath and kosher, ect, ect... Now I'm not saying this saves them, but is it their duty as still being Jews to keep the Law? And of course, I'm not saying at all that any Gentile convert to Christianity has to keep the Law, but as for the Jew that converts, well that's for us to discuss now...

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Brother,

If they convert to Christianity, they automatically become a jew. Read

Romans 2:28, 29. They become circumcised in the heart. Inward circum-

cism. They that are Christ's are Abraham's seed, according to the promise.

The promise of what! The promise of the Father! His Spirit! They that are

Christ are not under the law! They have been saved from the law of sin and

death. No man could be made righteous by the law. It was our schoolteacher,

to bring (lead) us to Christ!

Blessings,

Falla39

Praxeas · #17 02-02-2008, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRFrance

What am I missing here?

Why should they keep the law if, as you yourself say, there is no need for them to?

Yes you are missing something.

Should is not Need. Need is necessity. They do not NEED to keep the law. It is no requirement. They SHOULD keep the law just as the believing Jews in the bible kept the law. It was their identity and culture. The law taught some great truths about Christ in types and shadows and that would be a great way to show other Jews the truth of Christ

mfblume · #18 02-02-2008, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sept5SavedTeen

The last three or four verses of Isaiah mention that we will be celebrating the Shabbat in eternity.

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

What is the real sabbath, though?

Isaiah 49:6 has God speaking to Israel and telling them that they would be a light to the gentiles.

Quote:

Isaiah 49:6 KJV And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

Paul took this and applied it as a command to the CHURCH...

Quote:

Acts 13:47 KJV For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

The Old Testament prophecies are applied to the church age. Paul proved it above.

Also, Isaiah foretold things that were said to be fulfilled in JERUSALEM, that are actually fulfilled in the Bride, NEW Jerusalem.

Watch how people from ALL Nations fulfill what was specifically said to Jerusalem and israel in Isaiah:

Quote:

Revelation 7:9 KJV After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Revelation 7:13-17 KJV And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? (14) And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. (15) Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. (16) They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. (17) For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

Isaiah 49:3 KJV And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.

Isaiah 49:10 KJV They shall not hunger nor thirst; neither shall the heat nor sun smite them: for he that hath mercy on them shall lead them, even by the springs of water shall he guide them.

Quote:

Isaiah 60:10-12 KJV And the sons of strangers shall build up thy walls, and their kings shall minister unto thee: for in my wrath I smote thee, but in my favour have I had mercy on thee. (11) Therefore thy gates shall be open continually; they shall not be shut day nor night; that men may bring unto thee the forces of the Gentiles, and that their kings may be brought. (12) For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.

NEW JERUSALEM:

Revelation 21:24-26 KJV (24) And the nations [GENTILES IN GREEK] of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it. (25) And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. (26) And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it. (12) For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.

So the sabbath issue is not eternity... Jesus is our sabbath.

Quote:

Colossians 2:16-17 KJV Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: (17) Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

We must TRANSLATE the natural pictures of the Old Testament -- like natural Israel -- into spiritual pictures of the church and Christ. So that means the Sabbaths are actually truisms of Christ, and not a day any more.

Praxeas · #19 02-02-2008, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

So where in the NT does it tell us that the OT is done away with? This is a common misunderstanding in Christian circles. So, which "law" of the OT makes folks feel uncomfortable to follow?

The 10 commandments are for ALL....including the Sabbath.

The whole "Law" was a part of the Old Covenant. God made a NEW Covenant with us, NOT like the old one

Jer 31:31 "Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah,
Jer 31:32 not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the LORD.
Jer 31:33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the LORD: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

The Law serves as a school master to lead the to Christ.

Since we have a New Covenant we can look in the New Testament for what teachings are in that New Covenant and most of the 10 Commandments are reiterated and expanded on there

ManOfWord · #20 02-02-2008, 02:16 PM

To help some of you out here who need to know a little more about Judaism. Jews don't keep the law to be saved. They keep the law because they are Jewish. They don't keep it to become Jewish. They keep it because they ARE Jewish. The Jewish law is for identity not salvation.

A Jew who becomes a follower of Jesus Christ (the Pharisaic Jewish Rabbi) if he desires to remain Jewish may keep all of the law if he so chooses. He still understands that the final sacrifice was made on Calvary for his salvation. He doesn't HAVE to keep the law, however he may desire to keep the law to retain his Jewish (now Messianic) identity. I know of Messianic Jewish congregations who keep the law to varying degrees.

There are MANY things in Judaism which Christians would do well to understand. The law was NOT done away with. There is no evidence whatsoever that states that Paul ever stopped following Judaism. He did however, know that the keeping of the law did not bring salvation..Jesus Christ did.