Sabbath: In A Ditch Regarding the Seventh Day

[TRFrance]

Antipas has gotten kinda quiet lately.

Kinda strange.

[Sept5SavedTeen]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Antipas has gotten kinda quiet lately.

Kinda strange.

He's resting...

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

[James Griffin]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Antipas has gotten kinda quiet lately.

Kinda strange.

Cut him a break this was his first attempt at "theological" posts.

:-)

[Praxeas]

The sabbath was specifically a covenant sign to Israel as part of the Old Covenant.

Which covenant was replaced by the New Covenant. Which in turn begs the question of whether or not it is a New Covenant teaching. Which gives support to questioning or pointing what if anything the NT says or does not say on it.

Paul said to not let anyone judge you in pertaining to Sabbaths as well as other things. They had problems with judaizers.

Circumcision was not a requirement though that preceeded the law.

The Apostolic council, which met to determine what the Gentiles should keep as pertaining to the Law never mentioned the Sabbath though they mentioned blood and foots offered to idols.

Anti-Pas...I summed up our arguments for you when you get back from "resting".....

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Antipas

...nowhere does the Scripture state that the Philippian Jailor spoke in tongues or was baptized in the Holy Ghost. Why didn't the writer write about it? Because in Luke's mind it was a given, a no brainer, assumed that the reader wouldn't know any other process.
...

I think you are making an assumption here.
Because it is recorded that some early disciples received an experience which we call the Holy Ghost baptism (HGB), and because it is recorded that some of these who received that experience spoke with tongues and prophesied, does not mean that all early disciples had that same (HGB) experience or that they spoke with tongues.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

The Apostolic council, which met to determine what the Gentiles should keep as pertaining to the Law never mentioned the Sabbath though they mentioned blood and foots offered to idols.

But I know what Sabbatarians say about that! They claim the mention of synagogues after that statement is meant to inform the gentiles they can hear about the rest from the synagogues. They do not realize it is actually saying the gentiles had better be told all they have to deal with, or else the synagogues will add more rules to them.

Acts 15:20-21 KJV But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. (21) For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

[Praxeas]

I think the purpose of this is that since there are Jews in every city and those Jews would be easily offended at gentiles eating food offered to idols and blood. So in order to help win the lost they told the Gentiles from abstaining.

This I get from reading what Paul later said about food and idols

[Antipas]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

No he does not equate it with circumcision. He says we are circumcised in the heart, not flesh.


But since you brought that up, hebrews speaks of another rest

Circumcision also isn't an issue of the Ten Commandments. It's important to separate the Law of God (the moral law - Ten Commandments) from the Law of Moses (social and ceremonial laws).

[Antipas]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

I noticed he seemed to be selective about what posts he chooses to respond to.

Don't get me wrong guys...you're giving me good stuff to work with. I'm just going back and studying the subject and presenting things about it that come to mind. So if I'm a bit slow responding on topic remember, I have to look into it.

[Antipas]

Originally Posted by Encryptus

Oh I only pointed to a thread, Avahat Elohim wrote it: but since you didn't click on the thread I'll cut and paste it for you:

There have been many opinions expressed on this topic here. Especially in regard to keeping Shabbat.

May I present the Jewish perspective?

God loves us all. "Righteous people of all nations have a share in the world to come" (Sanhedrin 105a). He does not leave anyone, Jew or non-Jew without guidance. To the non-Jew He has given the Seven Commandments.

After the flood which killed everyone but Noah and his family, God sealed a covenant with Noah with the following seven admonitions:

1. Prohibition of Idolatry: You shall not have any idols before God.
2. Prohibition of Murder: You shall not murder.
3. Prohibition of Theft: You shall not steal.
4. Prohibition of Sexual Promiscuity: You shall not commit adultery.
5. Prohibition of Blasphemy: You shall not blaspheme God's name.
6. Prohibition of Cruelty to Animals: Do not eat flesh taken from an animal while it is still alive.
7. Requirement to have just Laws: You shall set up an effective judiciary to fairly judge observance of the preceding six laws

These Seven Laws of Noah are a set of seven moral imperatives which, according to the Talmud, were given by God to Noah as a binding set of laws for all mankind. Judaism states any non-Jew who lives according to these laws is regarded as a Righteous Gentile and is assured of a place in the world to come. Adherents are often called "B'nei Noah" (Children of Noah) or "Noahides" and often network in Jewish synagogues.

In Judaism, the ten commandments given Moses and the resulting 613 mitzvot or "commandments" given in the written Torah, as well as their reasonings in the oral Torah, were only issued to the Jews and are therefore only binding upon them, having inherited the obligation from their ancestors. Some Rabbinic opinion holds that not only are non-Jews not obligated to adhere to all the laws of the Torah, but they are actually forbidden to observe them. Rabbinic Judaism AND its modern-day descendants discourage proselytization. The Noahide Laws are regarded as the way through which non-Jews can have a direct and meaningful relationship with God or at least comply with the minimal requisites of civilization and of divine law.

The Talmud states a non-Jew who keeps the Noahide Law in all its details is said to attain the same spiritual and moral level as Israel's own Kohen Gadol (high priest). In a similar statement Maimonides states in his work Mishneh Torah that a non-Jew who is precise in the observance of these Seven Noahide commandments is considered to be a "Righteous Gentile" and has earned a place in the world to come.

Some such as Rabbi Menachem Mendel Schneerson, leader of the Chabad Lubavitch world Jewish movement believe that the Noahide Laws observance by all humankind will bring about universal peace and the Messianic Redemption.

(However, according to Maimonides, a gentile is considered righteous only if a person follows the Noahide laws specifically because he or she considers them to be of divine origin, through the Torah, and not if they are merely considered to be intellectually compelling or good rules for living.)

From the perspective of traditional halakhah, if a non-Jew keeps all of the laws covered by the Seven Noahide commandments, then he or she is considered a Ger Toshav "Sojourning Alien" amid the people of Israel. A "Ger Toshav" is the only kind of non-Jew who Jewish law permits to live among the Jewish people in the Land of Israel when the land is run according to Halacha and there is Sanhedrin/Temple.

(A Ger Toshav should not be confused with a Ger Tzedek who is a person who prefers to proceed to total conversion to Judaism, a procedure that is traditionally discouraged by Judaism and allowed to take place only after much thought and deliberation over converting.)

At this point I am sure there are others better qualified who would like to take up the discussion on the following topic:

It my understanding that the main disagreement among the early “apostles” was because the gentiles converts to Yeshua where considered by some to be Ger Tzedek and therefore should also obey all the mitzvot, but one Apostle Paul argued that Christianity was not just a division of Judaism and the gentiles should not bring themselves under the law, but were instead saved by “grace.”

(Perhaps part of the reason some thought the gentile coverts to Christianity to be Ger Tzedek may have been in part because of the baptism rituals practiced by Christians, which so closely mirrored those followed by gentiles who converted to Judaism, but that will be a different article).

Shalom

Judaism doesn't define us or the Bible.