Where is the Revival we have been waiting for? - Page 4

stmatthew · #31 05-24-2008, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

While I do watch the ministers you have mentioned and I like them, I follow what you are saying. There is nothing wrong with prosperity sermons, but like you were talking about it should not be the ONLY thing that we preach. I think that the OP as a whole preach some sort of prosperity. It seems that often the pastor is the most prosperious ones. Nothing wrong with a minister having great things. But we keep our focus on having to change diapers of the saints that are acting like babies. Too many excuses.

I hate it when there is something great going on in the spirit world like the FL revival and our first reaction is to discount it cause it ain't us. Horrible.

The FL "revival" is nothing more than another wind that will blow many seekers of truth away. It is, however, something that is going on in the spirit world. The prince of this world is at work to draw as many as he can away from sound doctrine by giving them a "feel good" revival. TB is into so much new age garbage one would have to be willingly blind not to see it.

shag · #32 05-24-2008, 10:30 PM

Could be in part, that we(the church)need an "internal revival" of nothing but "his will & way of doing things above ours", before God ever rains down more of an "external revival" of souls & miraculous miracles that everybody is looking for.

Especially here in the USA 2008, where many don't rely on God, because so many have it so good.

Heb. 6 talks about his church moving on into perfection. I'm not real sure if that is much of a popular priority.

Eph. 4 talks about the "5 fold", & why it is to be used in the church.
I think some are maybe having a difficult time giving up traditional ways of doing things, to atleast be passionately trying to find out and operate church 100% the bible way. (No, I sure don't have it all figured out either).

Many denominations are blowing us out of the water on "loving your neighbor", selflessness etc., while we're still busy talking to eachother about their lack of holiness standards & how bad they need to get the Holyghost.

I don't know if at all, or how much these thoughts play a role in the subject at hand. But I think they could possibly play a role in it. I wouldn't want to hand my car keys to a kid that wasn't mature enough to handle it. Just a thought.

stmatthew · #33 05-24-2008, 10:41 PM

Revival was always received the same way all through history.

2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

shag · #34 05-24-2008, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Revival was always received the same way all through history.

2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Good point. Amen

Raven · #35 05-25-2008, 06:28 AM

Good words Sam.

Raven

Jack Shephard · #36 05-25-2008, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew

The FL "revival" is nothing more than another wind that will blow many seekers of truth away. It is, however, something that is going on in the spirit world. The prince of this world is at work to draw as many as he can away from sound doctrine by giving them a "feel good" revival. TB is into so much new age garbage one would have to be willingly blind not to see it.

Brother, you think that the FL revival is pushing people away from God? He is the the truth. Doctrine is not THE ONLY truth it is just doctrine. The prince of this world is focused on getting people to deny God and accept him. TB may be new school, but again anything that does not look like we want it or sound like we want it does not mean it is not from God.

Jack Shephard · #37 05-25-2008, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotty

wow...thats all you got out of my post was offended?..sorry.....like I said....it was JMO...to bad you couldn't see what little good words may have been there through your determined rebuttle.....I will pray you find revival....tic

I was not offended. But I feel that you were arguing over symantics rather than the meaning of what was said. I welcome your prayers for me to have revival....I likewise will return the favor. LOL Have a good Day Scotty!

stmatthew · #38 05-25-2008, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

Brother, you think that the FL revival is pushing people away from God? He is the the truth. Doctrine is not truth it is just doctrine. The prince of this world is focused on getting people to deny God and accept him. TB may be new school, but again anything that does not look like we want it or sound like we want it does not mean it is not from God.

I am really having a hard time believing you just said that. Our whole faith is based upon doctrine. IF there is no doctrine preached, there is nothing in which to base faith upon. Faith MUST have its root in the Word of God (Doctrine). Otherwise it is like building a house upon the sands. IF Jesus was the example, and he taught doctrine during his earthly ministry, it must be just a little bit important.

Matthew 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:

Matthew 22:33 And when the multitude heard [this], they were astonished at his doctrine.

Mark 1:22 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for he taught them as one that had authority, and not as the scribes.

Mark 11:18 And the scribes and chief priests heard [it], and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine.

Luke 4:32 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for his word was with power.

Let me say this very plainly. There IS doctrine being preached in Lakeland, FL. The question is, does it come from God, or is it coming from a seducing spirit. I tend to believe that it is coming from the later, and her name is Emma.

Jack Shephard · #39 05-25-2008, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmatthew

I am really having a hard time believing you just said that. Our whole faith is based upon doctrine. IF there is no doctrine preached, there is nothing in which to base faith upon. Faith MUST have its root in the Word of God (Doctrine). Otherwise it is like building a house upon the sands. IF Jesus was the example, and he taught doctrine during his earthly ministry, it must be just a little bit important.

Matthew 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:

Matthew 22:33 And when the multitude heard [this], they were astonished at his doctrine.

Mark 1:22 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for he taught them as one that had authority, and not as the scribes.

Mark 11:18 And the scribes and chief priests heard [it], and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine.

Luke 4:32 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for his word was with power.

Let me say this very plainly. There IS doctrine being preached in Lakeland, FL. The question is, does it come from God, or is it coming from a seducing spirit. I tend to believe that it is coming from the later, and her name is Emma.

Sorry MAtt, I fixed my post to read how I meant it. Doctrine is not THE ONLY truth is what I was meaning. Sorry for confusion.

I have watched ALOT of the FL revival and not heard anything that could be linked to doctrine other than healings and miracles. I have heard tongues. Nothing about Emma and nothing about crazy things. I am not scared to be wrong about this guy, TB. If he is a quack then he is wrong. My point in this whole thing is that 'us' OP's tend to try and discount anything that can be God moving because it does not or did not happen within our walls. It is simple. Doctrine is important. Please do not think I am trying to discount that. I am trying to say that God on earth as Jesus was not ALL doctrine as most of 'us' are. We are so overly critical when it is happening to others and not us. I have even seen people get mad when God is moving in one of our churches and not another. People get all but hurt and say things like, 'they must be doing something. They must be watering down doctrine or something.' I have heard these things and it is rediculous.

Sam · #40 05-25-2008, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneAccord

Brother, as long as we try to split the outpouring of the Holy Ghost along doctrinal and or organizational lines, we will never see it. God is not divided. He pours His Spirit upon all flesh. ALL flesh. I remember the 70's and the "Jesus People". God began to move among them in a mighty way. What did we do? We snarled our nose at it and said it wasn't of God... We lifted not one finger to try to coax those long-haired, hippie Jesus freaks into the fullness of truth. We're Apostolic people involved in the Healing Revival? No... cause it ws being led by (egads!) Trinity preachers.

I've heard "revivals" like Brownstown and Smithton mocked and ridiculed, yet, except for small pockets of revival, the Apostolic Church bears little resemblence to Joels prophecy of Joel 2:28. And we claim to have ALL TRUTH. And I think you are right... we want it our way. We want the Joel 2:28 experience, we just don't want to have to endure the Joel 2:17 experience to get it. And we'll never have the one without the other.

Revival that resembles anything like Joel 2;28 isn't born at headquarters. Its not born in a committee room and it doesn't come through a craftily planned program. It is born in the Prayer Closet. A sacrifice must be made to inherit a blessing. The fact is... the Apostolic movement is a divided movement. Plain and simple. And as long as that is the case, and we seem to want it to remain that way.... we'll continue to be left on the bench while "the other team" scores.

AMEN!!!!!

I received the HGB on May 20, 1956 at Bethel Tabernacle UPC in Racine, Wisconsin. I attended one year 1956/1957 at the Apostolic Bible Institute in St. Paul, MN. I attended a UPC church here in the Cincinnati area from 1957 until some time in the early nineteen sixties. Then I attended an ALJC church from that time until I left in 1978 or maybe 1979. During that time I was a licensed minister at different times with three different organizations --The Church of Jesus Christ; The Church of Jesus Christ Pentecostal Faith; and the Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ. As we heard and read about people known as the Jesus People or the Jesus Freaks, and then later on folks called Charismatics we looked down our righteous noses at them. This couldn't be real. They didn't look like us. They didn't dress like us. They didn't baptize like us. They didn't believe like us. The didn't come to us to receive the Holy Ghost Baptism. We thought we had the exclusive franchise for God's Spirit. They went directly to God with hunger and thirst in their hearts, and, as He promised, He filled them. It took a while for this to soak through my hard head and my proud heart. God is pouring out His Spirit on ALL flesh, not just UPC, PAW, CoJC, ALJC, AMF, GIB flesh, but all flesh just like He said in His Word.