The "Abomination that Maketh Desolate"

[pkdad]

One English translated verb cannot change meaning in the Hebrew text. This is where preterism along with their misapplication of chronology misses it. Daniels visions are not in order as John's revelation is neither.
Just as many mad men and false Christs' tried to fulfill prophesy, Antiochus is one of them. The literal abomination he committed flys in the face of many principles Jesus taught to straighten out the "touch not, taste not, etc... of the Law! ie..."not what enters a man unclean" or regarding Sabbath violation etc...The desecration is not pigs and carnal happenings ...it will be spiritual pertaining to Apostasy in the end-times that the 1948 fulfillment began the countdown to the "false/Anti-Christ person and or system.

The only physical desecration is abortion, same sex marriage, human cloning, DNA re-engineering etc... and as the Church falls further into Apostasy by "heaping to themselves teachers, having itching ears."

As Famine is a sign of the end...Amos tells us it will not be of no food or water but of the "hearing" of the word! So once again a physical "Type and Shadow" pointing to the "spiritual" FULFILLMENT!

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by pkdad

One English translated verb cannot change meaning in the Hebrew text. This is where preterism along with their misapplication of chronology misses it. Daniels visions are not in order as John's revelation is neither.

Chronology of the visions has nothing to do with the issue. Futurism makes its biggest blunder in putting a gap in the 70 weeks of Daniel when nothing in the Bible says that. And whereas the New Testament says almost the exact words found in Dan 9:27 when it says sacrifices cease due to Christ's death, nothing in the New testament says anything about some antichrist causing sacrifices to cease.

So futurism has two strikes against it.

1) Daniel never said anything about a gap - (talk about chronology!)

2) Futurism has no New Testament reflection of their thought that antichrist causes sacrifices to cease, while the New Testament DOES associate Christ's death with the cessation of sacrifices in Dan 9:27 when we read Hebrews 10.

Just as many mad men and false Christs' tried to fulfill prophesy, Antiochus is one of them.

He did not TRY. He just fulfilled parts of Daniel 8 and 11 without knowing about it!

I know the prophecies in Daniel are not chronologically written, as evidenced by my claims that Dan 8 is about Antiochus as well as Daniel 11, but Daniel 9 is about the first century.

The literal abomination he committed flys in the face of many principles Jesus taught to straighten out the "touch not, taste not, etc... of the Law! ie..."not what enters a man unclean" or regarding Sabbath violation etc...The desecration is not pigs and carnal happenings ...it will be spiritual pertaining to Apostasy in the end-times that the 1948 fulfillment began the countdown to the "false/Anti-Christ person and or system.

It has already been 60 years since '48. If it goes another 60 years will people still say 1948 was the magic year?

The only physical desecration is abortion, same sex marriage, human cloning, DNA re-engineering etc... and as the Church falls further into Apostasy by "heaping to themselves teachers, having itching ears."

As Famine is a sign of the end...Amos tells us it will not be of no food or water but of the "hearing" of the word! So once again a physical "Type and Shadow" pointing to the "spiritual" FULFILLMENT!

These claims have no foundation, brother.

Let me ask you and all futurists something. Have you ever seriously considered you may be wrong and preterism may be right? In reading all our thoughts, have you ever considered we may be onto something,, instead of thinking of how we are wrong when you read? Are you open to the thought futurism may be wrong?

One futurist to whom I spoke admitted that at first when I spoke, he was not looking to see if I was right but looking for what he felt was an obvious flaw to find. Not many are that honest to admit it, but they do the same thing. This brother soon abandoned futurism.

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by mfblume

One futurist to whom I spoke admitted that at first when I spoke, he was not looking to see if I was right but looking for what he felt was an obvious flaw to find. Not many are that honest to admit it, but they do the same thing. This brother soon abandoned futurism.

Yep... me too!

[ronharvey]

I don't know what you call me, I just believe what the Bible says without trying to put a spin on it.

Ron

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by mfblume

It has already been 60 years since '48. If it goes another 60 years will people still say 1948 was the magic year?

To add to this, let me ask futurists at what point past 1948 will futurists admit prophecy cannot have regarded 1948? Where do we draw the line, and how many years are allowable to say 1948 is part of prophecy before the allowable time elapses? If the end does not come in 70 years past 1948, does that invalidate 1948 as part of prophecy or not? If not 70 years, then how many years will prove 1948 to not be part of prophecy?

Let me put it this way: From 1948 onward, by what year must the end have come?

Anyone, anyone?

[mfblume]

No one? no one?

[Lafon]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Let me put it this way: From 1948 onward, by what year must the end have come?

Anyone, anyone?

I would be hesitant to say that May 14, 1948 (the day in which the nation of Israel again declared themselves a member nation among the nations of the world), is the same day in which God has decreed that the final generation of man inhabiting the earth began, nor do I discount this entirely. After all, we are not to know the moment in which God has determined that final day of that last generation would be, only that we are made aware of the signs which are indicative of the nearness of the end.

Will May 14, 2018 (that is to say, 70 years from 1948) be day in which the Lord returns (in bodily form) to the land of Israel? Certainly no one can say that this is true, at least with any certainty, but on the other hand, it surely must be somewhere near that time period.

We find it stated in the closing portion of Hosea chapter 5, and continuing into the opening passages of chapter 6, that God said He would return to His place for two days (that is to say, 2,000 years), and in the third day He would return. And while we are not told when during the 3rd day His coming would take place, should we not conclude from such statements that His coming is near?

Just some thoughts about the matter of the time period during which I believe the Lord will return to the earth as He promised.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Lafon

I would be hesitant to say that May 14, 1948 (the day in which the nation of Israel again declared themselves a member nation among the nations of the world), is the same day in which God has decreed that the final generation of man inhabiting the earth began, nor do I discount this entirely. After all, we are not to know the moment in which God has determined that final day of that last generation would be, only that we are made aware of the signs which are indicative of the nearness of the end.

Will May 14, 2018 (that is to say, 70 years from 1948) be day in which the Lord returns (in bodily form) to the land of Israel? Certainly no one can say that this is true, at least with any certainty, but on the other hand, it surely must be somewhere near that time period.

So, for instance, if time goes past 2028, then one must agree 1948 was completely out of the ballpark when it comes to prophecy? That is what I am trying to ascertain.

We find it stated in the closing portion of Hosea chapter 5, and continuing into the opening passages of chapter 6, that God said He would return to His place for two days (that is to say, 2,000 years), and in the third day He would return. And while we are not told when during the 3rd day His coming would take place, should we not conclude from such statements that His coming is near?

No. I say that honestly. Saying one day = one thousand years in Hosea's prophecy is foundationless. I can take that scripture and teach Christ's resurrection that occurred on a literal third day and more correctly apply Hosea to our victory through the cross, I honestly think.

Just some thoughts about the matter of the time period during which I believe the Lord will return to the earth as He promised.

The Lord will return, but we have to rightly divide the Word and use passages that are meant to be understood as speaking of His future return and not "returns" that already occurred in the lifetimes of listeners present, as in Matt 16:28, or other passages that have nothing to do with His coming in any form.

Of course you may be right and I wrong.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by mfblume

So, for instance, if time goes past 2028, then one must agree 1948 was completely out of the ballpark when it comes to prophecy? That is what I am trying to ascertain.

Bump

[ronharvey]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Bump

Bump - Bump!

Ron