Has anyone seen the new movie Seven Pounds? I think it is one of the best movies I have ever seen.
***Spoiler**** If you haven't seen the movie, don't read on. For those who will never see it:
It is about a man who kills seven people in a car accident. He then tries to find seven people he can help. He gets to know the people he tries to help to see if they are worthy of his help. He donates part of his liver to one, gives away his house to another. At the end of the movie he commits suicide in order to give a woman he has fallen in love with a much needed heart transplant due to a rare blood type.
What strikes me most about the movie is that he intentionally commits suicide in order to give the woman he loves a much needed heart transplant. Isn't that what Christ did for us? Could Christ have avoided his death by answering the pharisees, pilate and herod differently? Did Christ commit suicide for us? And does that devalue the redeeming quality of his sacrifice? Just some thoughts that the movie provoked in me as I pondered it.
Jesus knew how it would play out all along right down to his answer to them so yes jesus basically commited suicide for us I don't know about devaluing if anything that just validates how much he loves us......But yea I would say Jesus committed suicide for us...
Has anyone seen the new movie Seven Pounds? I think it is one of the best movies I have ever seen.
***Spoiler**** If you haven't seen the movie, don't read on. For those who will never see it:
It is about a man who kills seven people in a car accident. He then tries to find seven people he can help. He gets to know the people he tries to help to see if they are worthy of his help. He donates part of his liver to one, gives away his house to another. At the end of the movie he commits suicide in order to give a woman he has fallen in love with a much needed heart transplant due to a rare blood type.
What strikes me most about the movie is that he intentionally commits suicide in order to give the woman he loves a much needed heart transplant. Isn't that what Christ did for us? Could Christ have avoided his death by answering the pharisees, pilate and herod differently? Did Christ commit suicide for us? And does that devalue the redeeming quality of his sacrifice? Just some thoughts that the movie provoked in me as I pondered it.
I did see that movie. I enjoyed the message, but I do think that martyrdom and suicide are two different things.
Suicide is maliciously ending your own life--by your own hand. Martyrdom is being put to death by another person or group of people for virtuous reasons.
For instance, I would protect one of my children with my life--but that isn't suicide--that's being killed by another person for a noble cause. Not by my choice, but by theirs.
Is a mother who runs into a burning house to rescue her child, only to lose her own life committing suicide? Of course not. She risks her own life to save her child, but it isn't with the intent to lose her own life, if it's possible to save it.
Christ allowed Himself to be martyred/sacrificed--yes! But did He take His own life? No.
As for the movie--I was disappointed with the ending, even though it was rather moving, because suicide falls outside of what I consider to be moral. I'm sure there are those here who think suicide is a perfectly acceptable way to end one's unhappiness or discomfort, and I find that rather disappointing. Life and death are in God's hands, and it is presumptuous, at the very least, for any human to step into God's place.
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"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
But see Jesus could of changed the outcome if he wanted to it was not someone else that killed him because he could control the outcome.. So technically he did take his own life cause he could of changed the outcome but I am sure glad it happened as it did....
But see Jesus could of changed the outcome if he wanted to it was not someone else that killed him because he could control the outcome.. So technically he did take his own life cause he could of changed the outcome but I am sure glad it happened as it did....
I see your point. Allowing someone to kill you, without resisting, could be considered suicide, I suppose.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
But see Jesus could of changed the outcome if he wanted to it was not someone else that killed him because he could control the outcome.. So technically he did take his own life cause he could of changed the outcome but I am sure glad it happened as it did....
KWSS, you could say that about lots of things. If a young man signs up for the military, he knows the risks, so if he gets killed, he essentially committed suicide. Or a fireman, going into a burning building knowing the risks--if the building caves in on him, he technically committed suicide.
It was the MAN Christ Jesus who died on the cross--the Spirit didn't die. And the MAN Christ Jesus suffered and was martyred just as any other human in the same circumstances.
God had the power to change the outcome, but then He has the power to prevent any human death, but doesn't. Does that make Him a murderer everytime someone dies?
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"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
KWSS, you could say that about lots of things. If a young man signs up for the military, he knows the risks, so if he gets killed, he essentially committed suicide. Or a fireman, going into a burning building knowing the risks--if the building caves in on him, he technically committed suicide.
It was the MAN Christ Jesus who died on the cross--the Spirit didn't die. And the MAN Christ Jesus suffered and was martyred just as any other human in the same circumstances.
God had the power to change the outcome, but then He has the power to prevent any human death, but doesn't. Does that make Him a murderer everytime someone dies?
No, certainly not. If anyone else did that, it would be murder, but God gets a pass. He stands by and watches lots of atrocities. Has the power to stop them, but doesn't. But that's fine. He's God. (Funny, nobody would let me get away with standing by and watching a toddler get hit by a train and say "That's fine. He's Timmy.")
Oh, this is all explained in the book "The Shack", of course. You see, God can't step in and stop, say, a child molester. That would be wrong. No, the only way He could have stopped something like that is 1) to interfere with the molester's free will (how awful!) or 2) not to have created in the first place. Yep. Those are the only two ways "God" could think of, in the book.
Sigh.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
God had the power to change the outcome, but then He has the power to prevent any human death, but doesn't. Does that make Him a murderer everytime someone dies
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