Read Segraves on "letting down hair"

[BobDylan]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

You are very funny to watch!

I hope I can be as entertaining for you, as you have been for me!

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

You are very funny to watch!

I don't know who I am talking to!!! Okay, the dude WITH the red hair is Dan. The dude WITH regular hair is Bob.

[Michael Phelps]

Originally Posted by BobDylan

MP, I've used the same reasoning in my discussions with Prax, LS has never taught "that there is magic in the hair" either... I see where you're going with this... but please see my point here.



I agree with this observation... these demonstrative acts were spontaneous "God-things". Not encouraged or orchistrated. You never read of the apostles specifically encouraging laying in their own shadows, or taking handkerchiefs. Point noted!

Your points duly noted, as well.

I'll tell you what I think of when we start talking about "laying hair on people" and "shaking hair in the wind" etc.........does anyone remember the "revivals" in Brownstown and Toronto a few years back? If I remember correctly, the participants were "roaring like lions" and "laughing in the spirit" among other things.

Now, I have witnessed people laughing in the spirit in times past, and I'm sure it was a "God thing" at the time, but when a preacher begins to urge people to "laugh in the spirit for a victory" it really takes on a different tone at that point, and seems to become a "magic formula".

I also have a problem when a preacher tells a congregation, "Ok, now EVERYONE pray in tongues RIGHT NOW".

I guess my point here is that I'm not against spontaneous moves of the spirit that may not necessarily have a Biblical precedent, but when those things are taught to the masses as being a part of our "doctrine", as it were, that's when I get up in arms.

[BeenThinkin]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

Your points duly noted, as well.

I'll tell you what I think of when we start talking about "laying hair on people" and "shaking hair in the wind" etc.........does anyone remember the "revivals" in Brownstown and Toronto a few years back? If I remember correctly, the participants were "roaring like lions" and "laughing in the spirit" among other things.

Now, I have witnessed people laughing in the spirit in times past, and I'm sure it was a "God thing" at the time, but when a preacher begins to urge people to "laugh in the spirit for a victory" it really takes on a different tone at that point, and seems to become a "magic formula".

I also have a problem when a preacher tells a congregation, "Ok, now EVERYONE pray in tongues RIGHT NOW".

I guess my point here is that I'm not against spontaneous moves of the spirit that may not necessarily have a Biblical precedent, but when those things are taught to the masses as being a part of our "doctrine", as it were, that's when I get up in arms.

Been Thinkin

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by BobDylan

This is the kind of erratic alarmism I was "blasting both barrells" at, and will continue to do so. Witchcraft is NOT a component of "each message" preached about this topic. In fact, when I heard it in person, witchcraft was not even mentioned.

If women are shaking hair, laying hair, or whatever as a means of focusing faith to believe for miracles, I have no problem with that. These effusive acts aren't alarming to me any more than people laying in Peter's shadows for healing, or sending Paul's handkercheifs and apron is alarming to me... I guess Peter's and Paul's followers were putting their faith in the object of Peter's shadow, or Paul's handkerchiefs, rather than in "God"??? I guess these people were worshipping "Peter" rather than the creator? HILARIOUS!!! ...

Ed, if I'm full of "it", you just wallowed in "it"... and "no I am not going to define what 'it' is"... You're the one, both barrells blasting, entering into a conversation nearing page 40 now, thinking you know something you don't know. I suggest you take a good dose of your own medicine before your incontrovertably anemic acumen becomes unpalatable and boring...

And FTR, I sure do love a good argument! I just wish you were a more formidable "opponend" (as in the argument, not in person).

I have a problem with it, the reason is they are objectifying their own hair

Im also a little leary of phrases like "focus your faith" which is unbiblical.

Does a woman's hair somehow help them focus their faith more on Christ? How?

Our faith should be In Him and Him alone...it seems that, even in "focusing" faith they are under the impression that hair has something to do with it. Why not use a sock? Clearly because they have been led to believe there is something special to do with HER hair.

Can I rub my short hair and expect a miracle?

All these examples really sound like objectifying woman's hair...it also sounds proud or even boastful.


That might be where the "magic" comes into play in the accusations. In fact it could be idolatry. Jews had that problem with Aaron's rod. Catholics objectify relics and expect miracles. They objectify statues and expect miracles. They objectify water from Lourdes

Magic practioners use talismans not just because they think

Focus talisman

A talisman is an object, often a crystal or gemstone, that has a specific ability to aid a person in focusing and amplifying his or her power. A talisman is not a lucky rock. The power of a talisman is its ability to aid you in achieving the future you desire.

A talisman is both a focus and a natural amplifier.

A talisman is an amplifier of the Universal Life Force

As an amplifier, a talisman brings you the ability to join with the power and energy of the Universal Life Force and the Life Force of this planet. This power and energy serve to multiply your own individual efforts. A talisman is, in a way, similar to a flashlight.
http://www.crystalvaults.com/pages/talismans.php


When I hear or read these "examples" this is what comes to mind.



The bible never speaks of her hair being for that.


It never gave examples of being used for that

[BobDylan]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I have a problem with it, the reason is they are objectifying their own hair

Im also a little leary of phrases like "focus your faith" which is unbiblical.

Does a woman's hair somehow help them focus their faith more on Christ? How?

Our faith should be In Him and Him alone...it seems that, even in "focusing" faith they are under the impression that hair has something to do with it. Why not use a sock? Clearly because they have been led to believe there is something special to do with HER hair.

Can I rub my short hair and expect a miracle?

All these examples really sound like objectifying woman's hair...it also sounds proud or even boastful.


That might be where the "magic" comes into play in the accusations. In fact it could be idolatry. Jews had that problem with Aaron's rod. Catholics objectify relics and expect miracles. They objectify statues and expect miracles. They objectify water from Lourdes

Magic practioners use talismans not just because they think

Focus talisman

A talisman is an object, often a crystal or gemstone, that has a specific ability to aid a person in focusing and amplifying his or her power. A talisman is not a lucky rock. The power of a talisman is its ability to aid you in achieving the future you desire.

A talisman is both a focus and a natural amplifier.

A talisman is an amplifier of the Universal Life Force

As an amplifier, a talisman brings you the ability to join with the power and energy of the Universal Life Force and the Life Force of this planet. This power and energy serve to multiply your own individual efforts. A talisman is, in a way, similar to a flashlight.
http://www.crystalvaults.com/pages/talismans.php


When I hear or read these "examples" this is what comes to mind.



The bible never speaks of her hair being for that.


It never gave examples of being used for that

Understood, and duly noted! Good points!

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by BobDylan

Understood, and duly noted! Good points!

Lil' grasshopper you are learning!

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I have a problem with it, the reason is they are objectifying their own hair

Im also a little leary of phrases like "focus your faith" which is unbiblical.

Does a woman's hair somehow help them focus their faith more on Christ? How?

Our faith should be In Him and Him alone...it seems that, even in "focusing" faith they are under the impression that hair has something to do with it. Why not use a sock? Clearly because they have been led to believe there is something special to do with HER hair.

Can I rub my short hair and expect a miracle?

All these examples really sound like objectifying woman's hair...it also sounds proud or even boastful.


That might be where the "magic" comes into play in the accusations. In fact it could be idolatry. Jews had that problem with Aaron's rod. Catholics objectify relics and expect miracles. They objectify statues and expect miracles. They objectify water from Lourdes

Magic practioners use talismans not just because they think

Focus talisman

A talisman is an object, often a crystal or gemstone, that has a specific ability to aid a person in focusing and amplifying his or her power. A talisman is not a lucky rock. The power of a talisman is its ability to aid you in achieving the future you desire.

A talisman is both a focus and a natural amplifier.

A talisman is an amplifier of the Universal Life Force

As an amplifier, a talisman brings you the ability to join with the power and energy of the Universal Life Force and the Life Force of this planet. This power and energy serve to multiply your own individual efforts. A talisman is, in a way, similar to a flashlight.
http://www.crystalvaults.com/pages/talismans.php


When I hear or read these "examples" this is what comes to mind.



The bible never speaks of her hair being for that.


It never gave examples of being used for that

[DAII]

Yep! This notion of focusing faith is an interesting one and worthy of further discussion. I think the term faith itself has a unique value in some OP circles that may contrast with what biblical faith is. I too conjure images of an attempt to harness energy with how this described by DKB. Why not rosary beads or a crucifix? Why not other objects or even my obedient feet?

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I have a problem with it, the reason is they are objectifying their own hair

Im also a little leary of phrases like "focus your faith" which is unbiblical.

Does a woman's hair somehow help them focus their faith more on Christ? How?

Our faith should be In Him and Him alone...it seems that, even in "focusing" faith they are under the impression that hair has something to do with it. Why not use a sock? Clearly because they have been led to believe there is something special to do with HER hair.

Can I rub my short hair and expect a miracle?

All these examples really sound like objectifying woman's hair...it also sounds proud or even boastful.


That might be where the "magic" comes into play in the accusations. In fact it could be idolatry. Jews had that problem with Aaron's rod. Catholics objectify relics and expect miracles. They objectify statues and expect miracles. They objectify water from Lourdes

Magic practioners use talismans not just because they think

Focus talisman

A talisman is an object, often a crystal or gemstone, that has a specific ability to aid a person in focusing and amplifying his or her power. A talisman is not a lucky rock. The power of a talisman is its ability to aid you in achieving the future you desire.

A talisman is both a focus and a natural amplifier.

A talisman is an amplifier of the Universal Life Force

As an amplifier, a talisman brings you the ability to join with the power and energy of the Universal Life Force and the Life Force of this planet. This power and energy serve to multiply your own individual efforts. A talisman is, in a way, similar to a flashlight.
http://www.crystalvaults.com/pages/talismans.php


When I hear or read these "examples" this is what comes to mind.



The bible never speaks of her hair being for that.


It never gave examples of being used for that

[pelathais]

How about this... can anyone bring forth real evidence that the use of a woman's uncut hair has ever been efficacious in bringing about a genuine miracle? There have been many claims and a lot of noise now about how we should just accept this practice because despite the constant appeals made by its proponents to articles and encyclopedias on witchcraft, this doesn't really involve anything like witchcraft. And, "many miracles" have taken place and "several prayers" have been answered.

How about a "Mount Carmel" exercise? Bring forth your uncut hair "aids to prayer" and let's see if God answers by fire.

And I mean real "fire" too. I've already seen the "prophets of Baal" jumping around and making a lot of noise. Let's see some fire from heaven if this is really what all the videos, sermons and books have claimed that it was.