Are all Catholics lost?

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by shazeep

sorry, i missed this. This is your opinion, but i can back mine up with Scripture, and you cannot. So there. If you have a Scriptural point to make Mr Badejo, then BAM do so, but please understand that i have had like a year of this partisan opinionizing already, and you have had a year to come up with something better than your groupthink opinion which defies Scripture without being aware of it. You are mocking me, without providing some Scriptural basis for your opinion. It is demonstrably not ridiculous, and i have provided many Scriptures to indicate so, sir. While you certainly are not compelled to my interpretation or understanding, it might be beneficial for you to at least pretend to some grasp of defamation from a Scriptural perspective.

You back up your views with scripture? Like we should never tell anyone to repent lest their feelings get hurt?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Jason B

On what page of this thread did I become obnoxious? You didn't seem to have a problem with me until I disagreed with you.

Exactly. And then he attacks our persons! I never said anything about him, and stated my beliefs. Suddenly, BAM!

[shazeep]

ya, and suddenly you got nicer. I think we maybe have different goals here, but i just keep assuming we are both seeking better answers.

"but the golden rule doesn't save us. already dealt with that."

i can't tell if you are intentionally misunderstanding me here, or just misdirecting to avoid an answer, but since that really doesn't make much sense, you earlier stated the Golden Rule as "i'm nice to anyone who is nice to me," and i was just giving you a chance to restate this if you like.

to say one is obnoxious because one doesn't believe one is saved by being kind, is the world's way of thinking.

yes, well fortunately that is not what i meant either, i think you should seek your own salvation, and i would suggest that others are free to do the same, which you may agree with or not. Obnoxious is strictly a subjective opinion, and no doubt many people pride themselves on their ability to avoid a point or dodge a question while appearing to give an answer.

So i would ask again if you wanna try again at "Read some Paul and viola" or not, but since i don't care anymore, i won't.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Esaias

And of course, you cannot see how obnoxious and offensive you are to others. You sit as judge, condemning everyone who is "not on board with Shazeep".

fair enough, yes, once every 50 posts i may get obnoxious, but at least i could point right to them--even if you never did--and apologize sincerely, even if i am not forgiven. And i don't care if you believe like i do, i hardly expect you to, Esaias. I have yet to meet anyone that believes like anyone else, tbh. If you want to believe "All Catholics are lost," i don't see how i could prevent you anyway; all i can do is quote how that is likely a bad way to look at salvation, and if you judge, you will be judged.

I'm kind of curious, if you guys really have something pertinent to say, why you didn't come to Mike's aid when he was twisting in the wind, those many times that he could not reply then, but cannot find now? Surely your dogma allows for better replies, and i have even tried to get him to take another whack--like every, single time--it isn't like i'm trying to hold anyone to some past statement of theirs absolutely, so what gives?

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Jason B

You back up your views with scripture? Like we should never tell anyone to repent lest their feelings get hurt?

well, i can only speak for myself, but i note that when i suggest that anyone repent of their ungodly attitude here, it is not accepted very well, is it? I have yet to get so much as a "hmm, maybe i'll have to take a look at that, ty." All i seem to be getting is either misdirection at the important points or "since i'm so sure that all Catholics are lost, i will post my justifications."

So it might be more beneficial all around to stop doing rebound (repentance) in a religious sense, and understand how it is accomplished in the everyday sense, which is the more spiritual, anyway--when someone wrongs you, you tell them how you have been offended, and they either express remorse and ask forgiveness or they do not, and you either forgive them regardless or follow Mike's stated understanding, at least until he changes his mind, or failing that changes his speech, which he has been given multiple opportunities to do now, so i have to believe that he is satisfied with his stated view on executing the Golden Rule, "I'm kind to them what's kind to me."

And we have examples of when the spirit is not represented, in demanding that your child apologize for some sin that they are not sorry for; and examples of when the spirit really shines, when you do not even take offense, and the guilty then have burning coals heaped on their head.

But you mean some religious thing, some essentially self-serving action done from fear of hell, not fear of having offended anyone, wadr. If you have to tell someone that they should repent of their evil deeds, and seek forgiveness, it becomes pertinent to ask which are they, a child or an imbecile?

Of course you mean to lead people to Christ in this manner, but see how that may actually be worse, and not better? Sure, a few people will eventually grasp that they deserve death even if they have been forgiven, and so come to some legal understanding of the need for Christ--as a religious icon, a get out of jail free card. But if you are confident in condemning Catholics you have never met for their doctrine, while blind to how they may be manifesting Christ despite their doctrine, then what have you really done? Of course we have many sweet spirits even in OP, and for all i know you guys are among them; i note that it is hard to get those types to defend doctrine much in real life, so we are kind of intentionally in a sort of bubble here.

So, to directly answer your question--i am telling you to repent (assuming you believe and teach that All Catholics Are Lost, of course); what is your reply?

[shazeep]

if you want to talk about who is the more obnoxious, or who is getting attacked, you might reflect upon a theoretical Catholic response to All Catholics Are Lost, or even an actual Catholic response to my objections there, to whit "Why bother with such obnoxious and self-serving people?" which for all you know i just made up, but nevermind. The point is that you have invited all of this. You asked for it. But of course as soon as I engage in a little dominance/submission to make a point, you are suddenly the one getting attacked.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by shazeep

So, to directly answer your question--i am telling you to repent (assuming you believe and teach that All Catholics Are Lost, of course); what is your reply?

and please note that i am not asking for a reply to the assumption, or to be led into a teaching moment of where the NT commands repentance, but your honest, personal reaction to being advised to repent (since that is already obvious).

[mfblume]

I asked you not to respond to my posts. you distort things too much. it's always an attack against me when you get upset. you can't stay objective. And this lying. ... saying I couldn't respond to you. ..


suddenly I am nice again. lol. I haven't changed my tone whatsoever. objective and dealing with my beliefs.

Get involved in a church and get some biblical teaching. it's not.. "anything i want to believe, goes".

no church teaches your doctrine. you have a private interpretation. God doesn't work like that.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I asked you not to respond to my posts.

so, you are posting to ask me not to respond to your posts? I'll pass, thanks. This is a forum, and your napoleon complex is irrelevant.

Originally Posted by mfblume

you distort things too much.

imagine how the author of the Golden Rule feels

Originally Posted by mfblume

it's always an attack against me when you get upset.

imagine how a Catholic feels, and that was obviously the point, Mike. And btw if i ever get upset, i'll let you know, ok?

Originally Posted by mfblume

you can't stay objective. And this lying. ... saying I couldn't respond to you.

well, you haven't yet, despite many invitations to do so. What gives? If you are happy with your answers then just say so; if you can better restate them to reflect your views, then do that.

Why all the coyness whenever i ask you to simply restate something that you cannot defend, such as "I'm kind to them what's kind to me"--or i can go dig up the exact quote if you like, since that is a paraphrase--or "Read some Paul, and voila!" which is an exact quote? I mean, you could hardly do any worse, so i don't get it.

Originally Posted by mfblume

suddenly I am nice again. lol. I haven't changed my tone whatsoever. objective and dealing with my beliefs.

well, none of the pages have disappeared, we could maybe go and have a look if you like. Look are you just here to continue moaning about how unfairly put-upon your person has been forced to unfairly endure, pastor, or would you actually like to say something?

Originally Posted by mfblume

Get involved in a church and get some biblical teaching.

go into a closet and suck eggs, Mike. Have a nice day, poser. Just following your directions there, pal. Please do not respond to my posts

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Jason B

You back up your views with scripture? Like we should never tell anyone to repent lest their feelings get hurt?

Originally Posted by shazeep

i am telling you to repent; what is your reply?

so since your reply effectively needs no restatement, let's move on to why a Catholic or your neighbor should be required to feel any different than you do, in the same position? What is it about you that should be respected, whereas they do not get this same respect?