You didn't ask "is the person of the son distinct from the Holy Spirit", but my answer is they are the same person. By "person" see earlier post where I quote Jason Dulle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
Let's say "human nature" is a human body..just for example. You are saying the Holy Spirit is a human body. Does that make sense?
Let's say Holy Spirit refers to the Divine nature of God...again then you have a contradiction. Divine nature is not Human nature...those are two different things
Let's say "Holy Spirit" is a person...again you have a contradiction. Persons are not natures. Persons HAVE nature.
Simply,
Person=a WHO
nature=a WHAT.
BTW I didn't say the Holy Spirit is the same Person as Christ. But even if I did, you said you agree. So again the problem is you have no distinction in terms, no catagories. Nature is the same thing as Person, Person is the same thing as nature..well that is simply not the case. That is why I asked my questions and a little bit why I really don't understand what it is you believe.
It's impossible for me to answer your questions because you view a person and a nature as the same thing
Father and Spirit are not components. Father and Spirit are actual ways the Person of God reveals Himself
Prax, I am not saying that person and nature are the same thing. I am asking you what the role of the holy spirit is in the person of christ. Christ blew on his disciples and said receive ye the holy ghost. So I'm saying that the holy spirit is an integral part of Christ. Are you saing that the holy spirit is part of christ's nature?
Prax, I am not saying that person and nature are the same thing. I am asking you what the role of the holy spirit is in the person of christ. Christ blew on his disciples and said receive ye the holy ghost. So I'm saying that the holy spirit is an integral part of Christ. Are you saing that the holy spirit is part of christ's nature?
My friend, thank you for clarifying that. However I am still confused because of what you've been saying. It really does sound like you do.
As I said before, I don't view "Father" and "Holy Spirit" as components like in a man we are body, soul and spirit...and Father is the equivalent of spirit and Holy Spirit of soul. So there is no answer.
Christ is a Person.
Christ is the same Person the Father is.
That means that Father and Son both exist distinctly but on a Personal level are the same person.
The Father has a Divine nature...that means He has all the stuff that makes someone God
The Son, being that same Person incarnate, has not only the Divine nature but also a Human nature.
The Holy Spirit is Divine and therefore forms nothing whatsoever of the Humanity of Christ. If I were to refer to the Holy Spirit as the Divine essence of God (nature, where God derives His Divine nature from) then I would say The Holy Spirit is united, not mixed, with the Humanity of Christ...In other words Christ is not a human nature. Christ is a Person (Yahweh, God) with the Divine nature of the Father and a Human nature in unity together
however I don't refer to the Holy Spirit strictly as the Divine nature since often in scriptures the term Spirit is personalized, I believe this refers to the Person of God in activity in His Spirit form
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
well Prax, I think we have exhausted the subject. I think I understand your view of Christ. I am not sure that my view of Chist is totally developed. To summarize your view(is this correct?), we have the person of christ/son with a divine nature and a human nature. He has a human mind, soul, spirit with the holy spirit/father united with his human spirit? Like humans have a body, soul ,spirit and the holyghost united with our human spirit. Is that your view?
My only point of contention is that where the holy ghost dwells in our spirit as humans, in Christ the holy spirit is an integral part of his person. This is where I disagree with you. The Holy Spirit is a manifestation of the person of Christ.
So I believe that the Holy Spirit is the person of Christ. How can you divide the human nature of christ from the person of christ which is the holy spirit?
well Prax, I think we have exhausted the subject. I think I understand your view of Christ. I am not sure that my view of Chist is totally developed. To summarize your view(is this correct?), we have the person of christ/son with a divine nature and a human nature. He has a human mind, soul, spirit with the holy spirit/father united with his human spirit? Like humans have a body, soul ,spirit and the holyghost united with our human spirit. Is that your view?
My only point of contention is that where the holy ghost dwells in our spirit as humans, in Christ the holy spirit is an integral part of his person. This is where I disagree with you. The Holy Spirit is a manifestation of the person of Christ.
So I believe that the Holy Spirit is the person of Christ. How can you divide the human nature of christ from the person of christ which is the holy spirit?
close enough.
However I don't divide the human nature of Christ from the person of Christ. The Holy Spirit is not the human nature of Christ. That is a catagory error. That is like saying "Dedicated Mind's finger is his ear".
That is like saying "The Spirit of God is the body of Christ"...Spirit, the very word, means "incorporeal being"...Body, is a created physical thing. Holy Spirit is uncreated. Human nature is created.
Keep developing and thinking. It's good to see someone interested in this. Try reading more of Jason's stuff through from beginning to end, a mere snippet like I posted here might be confusing at first without reading what else he said
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
And how do you define "be"? Infinitive verb whose 3rd pers. sing. pres. indic. form is "is"?
verb and auxiliary verb,present singular 1st personam, 2ndare or (Archaic) art, 3rdis, present pluralare; past singular 1st personwas, 2ndwere or (Archaic) wast or wert, 3rdwas, past pluralwere; present subjunctivebe; past subjunctive singular 1st personwere, 2ndwere or (Archaic) wert, 3rdwere; past subjunctive pluralwere; past participlebeen; present participlebeˇing.
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
verb and auxiliary verb,present singular 1st personam, 2ndare or (Archaic) art, 3rdis, present pluralare; past singular 1st personwas, 2ndwere or (Archaic) wast or wert, 3rdwas, past pluralwere; present subjunctivebe; past subjunctive singular 1st personwere, 2ndwere or (Archaic) wert, 3rdwere; past subjunctive pluralwere; past participlebeen; present participlebeˇing.
When time travel is invented, many more tenses will need to be invented (says Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy ).
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
) art, 3rdis, present pluralare; past singular 1st personwas, 2ndwere or (Archaic
).
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