I used to tour with them. Their dad was a Baptist preacher, but left the ministry. I don't recommend their music...
Their music is actually very good, from a purely secular point of view--but I wouldn't recommend it either, for a Christian.
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"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
Baptist? I thought their dad was a UPC preacher....
Wiki sez so:
"...Jared and Caleb were born in Tennessee, while Matthew and Nathan were born in Oklahoma. Matthew is the three brothers' cousin and their step brother, Owen plant. The brothers and Matthew spent much of their youth travelling around the South with their father, Leon, a traveling United Pentecostal Church preacher and their mother, who taught them when they were not in school. According to Rolling Stone magazine, "While Leon preached at churches and tent revivals throughout the Deep South, the boys attended and were occasionally enlisted to bang on some drums. They were home-schooled or enrolled in small parochial schools. Except for a five-year stretch when they settled in Jackson, Tennessee, the Followills spent their childhoods driving through the South, camping for a week or two wherever Leon was scheduled to preach....""
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"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
Baptist? I thought their dad was a UPC preacher....
Wiki sez so:
"...Jared and Caleb were born in Tennessee, while Matthew and Nathan were born in Oklahoma. Matthew is the three brothers' cousin and their step brother, Owen plant. The brothers and Matthew spent much of their youth travelling around the South with their father, Leon, a traveling United Pentecostal Church preacher and their mother, who taught them when they were not in school. According to Rolling Stone magazine, "While Leon preached at churches and tent revivals throughout the Deep South, the boys attended and were occasionally enlisted to bang on some drums. They were home-schooled or enrolled in small parochial schools. Except for a five-year stretch when they settled in Jackson, Tennessee, the Followills spent their childhoods driving through the South, camping for a week or two wherever Leon was scheduled to preach....""
He was UPC and they pastored very close to where we live.
I didn't get involved for several pages of this thread, but I was amazed to see how quickly in this conversation it became a conversation about how the UPC made these situations happen. One would think that what happened to the Kings of Leon was not happening in infinitely greater numbers among other musicians and entertainers raised in other organizations. I have been openly critical of things we need to be critical about, but this just did not add up to me, and did not jive with my experiences and what I have seen all over this country and in the world.
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There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
It's not just a matter of discussing an issue or asking questions. Its the tone and the spirit in which its being "discussed". In case you havent noticed yet, there are some who always have a negative agenda whenever the UPC is being discussed. The negativity of their tone is so obvious that they couldnt hide it even if they tried. After a while that gets tiresome. Its the same "finger-pointing, blame the org, blame the doctine/blame the church culture/ the strict pastor, or blame whatever else" mentality.
Yes, we know no org is perfect, and discusssion of the issues within an org can be done in a constructive way and yeild some good. But the consistent hyper-critical, moaning, groaning, finger pointing and accusatory tone that some people always bring to the discussion is not productive at all. With some of these folks, all it is is another opportunity to "vent" once again against the organization they left... an organization which some of them clearly still have bad feelings about.
This mudslinging disguised as "discussion of the issues" becomes very transparent after a while.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tstew
I didn't get involved for several pages of this thread, but I was amazed to see how quickly in this conversation it became a conversation about how the UPC made these situations happen. One would think that what happened to the Kings of Leon was not happening in infinitely greater numbers among other musicians and entertainers raised in other organizations. I have been openly critical of things we need to be critical about, but this just did not add up to me, and did not jive with my experiences and what I have seen all over this country and in the world.
You guys still hold dear many of the traditions and doctrines of the Oneness movement. Many who devoted their whole lives and sacrificed to the same movement now find out that, in their opinions either right or wrong, much of it was a bunch of hogwash. They are hurt because they feel like they were lied to, manipulated, and possibly even gave up a huge part of their life for certain doctrines.
Yes some are bitter. When these people finally get out and discover certain things it takes time to work past all the hurt feelings.
In addition, some will keep telling their story in order to influence others who are searching and trying to decide if they should stay in the movement or not. Many come to these forums is search of understanding and I firmly believe that many minds are being changed because of the discussion on the forums.
You guys still hold dear many of the traditions and doctrines of the Oneness movement. Many who devoted their whole lives and sacrificed to the same movement now find out that, in their opinions either right or wrong, much of it was a bunch of hogwash. They are hurt because they feel like they were lied to, manipulated, and possibly even gave up a huge part of their life for certain doctrines.
Yes some are bitter. When these people finally get out and discover certain things it takes time to work past all the hurt feelings.
In addition, some will keep telling their story in order to influence others who are searching and trying to decide if they should stay in the movement or not. Many come to these forums is search of understanding and I firmly believe that many minds are being changed because of the discussion on the forums.
Delta, some have had legitimately bad experiences with some people in the org and I get that. What I'm saying is that that is a function of dealing with a body of human beings and that there is no group of people who are exempt from this. There are people in all kinds of churches all over the country who have had some negative experiences with people. I have had some negative experiences with people, but I choose not to allow it to overshadow my many positive experiences.
The other issue is that people look at some of the people they dealt with and make sweeping generalities about an international organization that just are not true. I am genuinely sorry for anyone who feels they have been wronged and I pray that they can overcome their bitterness, but I will always resist any attempt to paint the entire organization with the brush that affected them.
I know too many great people and leaders in the organization to allow that. I would not trade my church for any other in the country.
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There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Delta, some have had legitimately bad experiences with some people in the org and I get that. What I'm saying is that that is a function of dealing with a body of human beings and that there is no group of people who are exempt from this. There are people in all kinds of churches all over the country who have had some negative experiences with people. I have had some negative experiences with people, but I choose not to allow it to overshadow my many positive experiences.
The other issue is that people look at some of the people they dealt with and make sweeping generalities about an international organization that just are not true. I am genuinely sorry for anyone who feels they have been wronged and I pray that they can overcome their bitterness, but I will always resist any attempt to paint the entire organization with the brush that affected them.
I know too many great people and leaders in the organization to allow that. I would not trade my church for any other in the country.
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His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
Delta, some have had legitimately bad experiences with some people in the org and I get that. What I'm saying is that that is a function of dealing with a body of human beings and that there is no group of people who are exempt from this. There are people in all kinds of churches all over the country who have had some negative experiences with people. I have had some negative experiences with people, but I choose not to allow it to overshadow my many positive experiences.
The other issue is that people look at some of the people they dealt with and make sweeping generalities about an international organization that just are not true. I am genuinely sorry for anyone who feels they have been wronged and I pray that they can overcome their bitterness, but I will always resist any attempt to paint the entire organization with the brush that affected them.
I know too many great people and leaders in the organization to allow that. I would not trade my church for any other in the country.
The reason why you can paint the whole organization a certain way is because the doctrine of the UPC is so different that other Christian denominations. The doctrine and subculture resulting from the doctrine is part of the whole organization.
Yes, I believe that their are certain bad experiences but I believe that a lot of the problems come from an incorrect teaching of the gospel. You can compare other denominations and groups who have gotten away from the gospel of Christ and you see the exact same issues in these groups that are plaguing the UPC/Oneness movement.
Acts 2:38 is a great message but it is not the gospel. I truly would love to see everyone filled with the holy spirit and baptized in Jesus name but not at the expense of the gospel. The holiness movement, charismatics, word of faith, prosperity gospel, Oneness Pentecostals, Mormons, JW, all faced and are facing the consequences of not placing enough emphasis on the foundation of Jesus Christ and simplicity of the gospel. What happens is folks start to put their faith in something other than Christ.
My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. 
Hybrid Mode
