The Name

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

See, I don't get this. The AOG or COG members that I know accept that Jesus is the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost.

They do? That is unusual....most Trinitarians believe the name Jesus is the name of the Son. And I have met very few AOGers that believe otherwise

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Joelel

You have to look up Jehoshua because it is the right trancelation of the Son of God's name from Hebrew.2424. Iesous ee-ay-sooce' of Hebrew origin (3091); Jesus (i.e. Jehoshua), the name of our Lord and two (three) other Israelites:--Jesus.

Then to the Greek that the Son of God and most Hebrews spoke at that time.3091 Yhowshuwa` yeh-ho-shoo'-ah or Yhowshua {yeh-ho-shoo'-ah}; from 3068 and 3467; Jehovah-saved; Jehoshua (i.e. Joshua), the Jewish leader:--Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Joshua. Compare 1954, 3442.

I don't know where people get Yah,Yawah and all them other spellings from.Unless it's short for Yhowshuwa

Yahweh is the vowel version of the Hebrew Tetragrammaton YHWH....

Every time you see Capital L O R D in your bible the hebrew word is the consonants YHWH. "I am the LORD, that is my Name"....LORD there is YHWH....the vowels are added as an estimation of how the name sounded.

Yehovah is derived from taking vowels from Adonai and inserting them into the vowels. I think the original hebrew is a V sound.

English changed the Y to a J.

Jesus is from the latin Iesus which is from the greek Iesous which is from the Aramaic Yeshua which is the shortened form of the hebrew Yehoshua

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop

This Michael just don't get it! He keeps saying what he THINKS I am saying but he has not got it right yet.
1. I don't care if you baptize in motor oil in the name of Harry Carry - just don't tell me you have some special revelation of "more" that excludes me and makes you so Holy and superior and Exclusive and that me and my four are LOST!
2. I never said or insinuated that the Jews or Hebrew speaking people COULD NOT use the English name of Jesus.
3. If you are an English Speaker - the Bible you use is in English and the Name you preach, live, move and baptize in is Jesus Name, Jesus Christ or Lord Jesus Christ - depending on what branch you come from.
4. If you are Spanish, Chinese, Japanese or Siamese - you read, speak, write and BAPTIZE in that language.
5. If you go to another country and baptize - it is a good thing to learn some of the language so you can baptize in that native language.
6. If a Hebrew speaking Christian comes to an English Speaking nations - he should learn English so he can be more effective in his ministry. He would have the option to baptize Hebrew speaking people in Hebrew and English Speaking People in English.

Now is that so hard to understand????????

Michael - Can you read, speak, write and carry on a conversation in Hebrew?
Guys like you never stop at just KNOWING the Hebrew Name - it is a REVELATION "MORE" to you and then you have to gain converts to your HEBREW NAME doctrine and I assume that you do not read, speak, write or carry on a conversation in Hebrew. From what I have read - you feel that you are special and that "MORE" has been revealed to you and so you use what YOU think is the Hebrew name for our Lord Jesus Christ.
The fact remains ladies and gentlemen - Michael does NOT know what he is talking about!
You can get 100 of these YHWH - YAHWEH -YASHUA HAMASHEA whatever guys in a room and NONE of them can agree on even THE HEBREW NAME! They have all these different spellings and pronunciations and they can not even agree among them selves.

He skirts the issue to make us THINK that the name JESUS is the most beautiful word in the English language. He don't believe his own press! If he did - he would move to Israel - learn Hebrew and baptize the Jews in the Name above all names (PICK A HEBREW NAME) and leave us stupid English speaking dumbbells alone!
This kind of doctrine ends up with - They speak Hebrew in Heaven and if you want to go to heaven and understand God and the Angels - you have to go to Hebrew School and learn Hebrew. It also includes - we have more Revelation than you because WE KNOW THE ORIGINAL NAME IN HEBREW - but we cannot even agree on it among our YAWH sects. This stuff keeps changing and changing until they are the exclusive bearers of the Revelation and everyone is lost but them.
It is heresy - IMHO!!!!!!!!!!

Michael turns the other cheek and says "Lord bless my adversary".

[Michael The Disciple]

I had been studying on this issue on and off for a while back in the early 80's. I became interested in it for the same reason I became interested in Oneness. Because I wanted to know the truth if I was lacking therein.

I prayed earnestly about it in one point in time. Is it important to you Lord? I worked the dock in those days. There was a certain Truck Driver for Cresent Unijax out of Indiana that picked up paper from us weekly.

He had been doing this as I recall for 4 or 5 years. He was called Butch from the first day I saw him there. No one ever called him anything else. We knew things about his wife and kids and what was going on in his life. We knew HIM.

At the point in time I mentioned earlier I came off my break and the secretary took several of us aside and said:

"The Cresent Unijax driver said to tell you guys his name is not Butch it is Jim" "He would appreciate it if you would call him by his name".

As I had been praying on this I immediately saw the hand of the Lord in it. I believed then and still do the Lord was answering my prayer. Do I believe it was a "revelation"? You bet!

Have I ever taught anyone they are lost because they pray to Jesus or use his name? NEVER. I posted my forum which dates back about 5 years or so. Search and see whoever is looking for the "secret agenda". Tell me when you find me saying it.

I am baptized into the name of Yeshua. Why? Because it is the original name. I have baptized a number of people into it. Do I go looking for people to press them into doing so? Again check my forum and see. Its right there in the open.

I have baptized mostly new converts that way after explaining it is the original and a few others who upon studying it for themselves asked me to do so.

I have never and I mean NEVER criticized the name Of Jesus. It is wonderful and glorious. But I do believe that to use Yeshua IS pleasing to the Lord. I believe there is a real move of his Spirit to give us the knowledge of the original name. It is happening all over the world.

And yes it does involve deeper truth. When you learn something you did not know before you have went deeper in truth. I want to walk in all the truth made known to me. Some say this is pride and arrogance. Well thats what Trins and Arians say about all Apostolics.

There are those who say the same because of the foundation doctrines I hold. I am not ashamed of what I believe.

As far as saying one is lost because they dont know Hebrew only a minority of those using the Hebrew form says so. Certainly not myself.

We will be judged by the full measure of what we are. Not what language we speak.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

And yes it does involve deeper truth. When you learn something you did not know before you have went deeper in truth. I want to walk in all the truth made known to me. Some say this is pride and arrogance. Well thats what Trins and Arians say about all Apostolics.

There are those who say the same because of the foundation doctrines I hold. I am not ashamed of what I believe.

As far as saying one is lost because they dont know Hebrew only a minority of those using the Hebrew form says so. Certainly not myself.

We will be judged by the full measure of what we are. Not what language we speak.

I'm sorry Michael ... I can respect you personal conviction, on this issue. I can also respect if you preach,teach, and practice it with new converts.

Don't be ashamed of what you believe

but when we start delving into proclaiming DEEPER TRUTHS ... it starts to send off my alarms. I start to worry ... sorry ...Perhaps it's the dangers I've encountered in my lifetime with folks who claimed to have 'new' revelations and what it often leads to.

I have many beliefs that may not be traditional to some but I don't see any of them as being new and necessarily deeper.

Apparently you are tolerant of your other OP brethren and accept their fellowship. I encourage you to use the Word primarily in making you points about why we should use the name Yeshua. Most folks aren't into lexicons and history ... although I am. Make your case ... with biblical texts. If not, some will not take heed.

JMO

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

I'm sorry Michael ... I can respect you personal conviction, on this issue. I can also respect if you preach,teach, and practice it with new converts.

Don't be ashamed of what you believe

but when we start delving into proclaiming DEEPER TRUTHS ... it starts to send off my alarms. I start to worry ... sorry ...Perhaps it's the dangers I've encountered in my lifetime with folks who claimed to have 'new' revelations and what it often leads to.

I have many beliefs that may not be traditional to some but I don't see any of them as being new and necessarily deeper.

Apparently you are tolerant of your other OP brethren and accept their fellowship. I encourage you to use the Word primarily in making you points about why we should use the name Yeshua. Most folks aren't into lexicons and history ... although I am. Make your case ... with biblical texts. If not, some will not take heed.

JMO

I defined deeper truth as learning something I did not know before. People who study scripture much will usually learn deeper truths as time goes by.

And this is not a new revelation. It has always been true. At point in time what was ALREADY TRUE was revealed or made known to ME.

You tell me to make my case with Biblical texts. Well see that is the whole point of the issue. Is the original name brought down from Heaven by the Angel Gabriel the English name Jesus? In the English Bible it transliterates that way. But it self is not THAT name.

Remember I said early on this might not be important to some but it is to me. I want to know my Lord and God as fully as possible.

And again Why should I have to justify to anyone the fact I use Yeshua? THAT IS THE TOPIC OF THE THREAD. That is the name his Mother called him and the Apostles. It is a glorious name. Why should anyone be offended by it?

If Jews were talking among themselves should they get upset if one of them dared to call Yeshua Jesus?

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I defined deeper truth as learning something I did not know before. People who study scripture much will usually learn deeper truths as time goes by.

And this is not a new revelation. It has always been true. At point in time what was ALREADY TRUE was revealed or made known to ME.

You tell me to make my case with Biblical texts. Well see that is the whole point of the issue. Is the original name brought down from Heaven by the Angel Gabriel the English name Jesus? In the English Bible it transliterates that way. But it self is not THAT name.

Remember I said early on this might not be important to some but it is to me. I want to know my Lord and God as fully as possible.

And again Why should I have to justify to anyone the fact I use Yeshua? THAT IS THE TOPIC OF THE THREAD. That is the name his Mother called him and the Apostles. It is a glorious name. Why should anyone be offended by it?

If Jews were talking among themselves should they get upset if one of them dared to call Yeshua Jesus?

Well Said...

[Joelel]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Michael turns the other cheek and says "Lord bless my adversary".

Michael,I would watch who i said God Bless to also.2 John10:9: Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
10: If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speedsay God bless you)
11: For he that biddeth him God speed (says God bless you) is partaker of his evil deeds

[ThePastorsCoach]

Originally Posted by Joelel

Michael,I would watch who i said God Bless to also.2 John10:9: Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
10: If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speedsay God bless you)
11: For he that biddeth him God speed (says God bless you) is partaker of his evil deeds

You are getting funnier all the time!

[Joelel]

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop

You are getting funnier all the time!

Well alot of people will find this not to be funney some day.2 John10:9: Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.