Hell and suicide?

[Ron]

Originally Posted by crakjak

Sorry, (no, I am not sorry) but I can't find the God that you describe in this post in the scripture. The monster that would create such a place of necessity would have to be Satan, or at least his deceptive lies. Sounds like a horror movie, created by some carnal and depraved Hollywood writer.

Certainly not the Creator, the Heavenly Father, the Judge that will "do right".

The scripture says that our God is a "refining fire", His fires are for one purpose, and that is to refine, to purge, to prune, to correct and to set things right.

Sooo, by that token ole Lucifer is going to be back in Heaven one day?

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

Jermyn, I understand why you make these statements, but they are no more true than claiming that there's no reason to NOT win the lottery since there's always a chance. However, if one doesn't buy a ticket, let alone even know there IS a lottery, how do they have a chance to win?

Believe it or not, people die every day having no idea that there is a true plan of salvation out there they might have had. Being in America makes it no different than being in Iraq.

If the Bible was so cut and dried, there would be no reason for a Judgment Day, IMO.

If this man had just only walked in the light of what he had known, of what he may have been exposed to, his chances of committing suicide would have been greatly diminished.


I guess when 9/11 happened, the thought of God never seized his heart, even for a brief moment, while the rest of the country looking for answers poured into churches all around.

I guess he was NEVER invited to Sunday School.

The "door knockers" always skipped his house.
God hid him from the street witnessers.
He NEVER drove by a church and when he did, he never saw the sign.


I am not being light with this man's untilmely demise.
However, our just and merciful God extended His hands to this man, like he does all and this man simply decided to do things on his own.

There isn't any way a person can convince me that there is an American adult who has NEVER been invited to a church. I can not be convinced that this grown American adult never drove by a church and never had not one Christian in his life.

If all he ever knew were Baptists, at least they are Christians with a relationship with God. However, the tragedy here is that this man probably rejected any and all Christian influence.

So he crumbled under te weight of his tragic life, when the whole time God was there to help him- but he rejected God's help.

So as a Christian, in light of God's Holy Word, the argument that this guy NEVER HAD A CHANCE IS IMPOSSIBLE!!!

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by crakjak

JD,

Maybe, you assume that because he may have heard a gospel message at sometime in his life that he had a reasonable and responsible opportunity to respond to the gospel.

I would suggest that due to his experience he more than likely would not have been able to comprehend the Good News. His father and mother died early in his life, to an infant that can be the same as abandonment. Those responsible for his wellbeing and care then abused him. What kind of context is this for someone to understand that there is a unseen benevolent father that loves him?

It is not possible that ALL humans have a fair opportunity to receive the gospel in this life. I will go so far to say that is not God's plan that all will hear and understand the gospel in this life. 1) Therefore, it is clear that He does not stop reaching for "the lost sheep" when this life ends. 2) Why would God create the billions of humans since creation and then abandon the greatest portion of them? 3) If it was that we have hope in this life only, 4) God would have established a better context for ALL to hear and to receive.

I would suggest reading "Hope Beyond Hell" "The righteousness of God's judgment" by Gerry Beauchemin. You can read it online.

http://www.tentmaker.org/books/hope_beyond_hell.pdf

1) Scripture?

2) Was not the world DESTROYED by water once before with only ONE FAMILY being saved?

3) This sounds like a portion of scripture, but twisted to fit your falsely comforting view of the Gospel.

4) So the blood of Jesus Christ is not enough for you? Or is it enough for you, but not enough for your neighbor?



I have lost loved ones who are dead and I refuse to be comforted for them.

No! Instead of comforting ourselves with false doctrines and twists of scripture bent upon human emotions, why don't we spend our time living our lives in a way where we can reach those who have not committed suicide, those who are still here! That sister who is incarcerated, Shawndell, have you attempted t reach her or have you encouraged the person who knows her to reach her with the Gospel of Christ?


Why should anyone be comforted with the sucide of someone who was lost when they died?

Don't be comforted! Be stirred and moved to action for the sake of the sick and dying around you!

What's done is already done.
This isn't patty-cake, this is war with real souls at stake!

I hope NO ONE is comforted with the death of this young man! NO ONE!!!!

I hope all who hear his story are moved to action in Jesus Name!!!

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Ron

Sooo, by that token ole Lucifer is going to be back in Heaven one day?

Everything in the earth, everything under the earth, everything above the earth, everything in the sea ... the whole creation is going to be made whole.

The curse and all sin will be brought to an end. That is Bible, is Lucifer in this context somewhere, everything is going to be made right. Nothing that opposes Him will remain, in hell or anywhere else. "...that He may be all in all."

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

1) Scripture?

2) Was not the world DESTROYED by water once before with only ONE FAMILY being saved?

3) This sounds like a portion of scripture, but twisted to fit your falsely comforting view of the Gospel.

4) So the blood of Jesus Christ is not enough for you? Or is it enough for you, but not enough for your neighbor?



I have lost loved ones who are dead and I refuse to be comforted for them.

No! Instead of comforting ourselves with false doctrines and twists of scripture bent upon human emotions, why don't we spend our time living our lives in a way where we can reach those who have not committed suicide, those who are still here! That sister who is incarcerated, Shawndell, have you attempted t reach her or have you encouraged the person who knows her to reach her with the Gospel of Christ?


Why should anyone be comforted with the sucide of someone who was lost when they died?

Don't be comforted! Be stirred and moved to action for the sake of the sick and dying around you!

What's done is already done.
This isn't patty-cake, this is war with real souls at stake!

I hope NO ONE is comforted with the death of this young man! NO ONE!!!!

I hope all who hear his story are moved to action in Jesus Name!!!

Yes, the world that was, was destroyed by water, however you will not be able to use scripture to find the folks destroyed by the flood in some torture chamber called Hell. It was temporal judgment and in no way describes their ultimate end.

So you believe God will add insult to injury, and cast this poor abused and "lost sheep" into an unending torture chamber? No, my friend Jesus died for the sins of all men, for the whole world.

And just as Adam's sin brought condemnation to ALL (I bet you won't deny, that statement), Jesus' blood bought the freedom of each and everyone from Adam's curse. Where sin abounded, the blood of Jesus much more abounded.

No one should be comforted by this young man's death, his is a tragic life. But we should be comforted that the heavenly Father will do what is right for him. God's justice is always loving, and His loving is always just, he will purge him as a refiner of gold or silver, until all impurities are removed and he will clearly see and embrace His heavenly Father.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by crakjak

Everything in the earth, everything under the earth, everything above the earth, everything in the sea ... the whole creation is going to be made whole.

The curse and all sin will be brought to an end. That is Bible, is Lucifer in this context somewhere, everything is going to be made right. Nothing that opposes Him will remain, in hell or anywhere else. "...that He may be all in all."

You been hanging around Carton Pearson to long.
Good to know there is nothing to be saved from & that hell was just conjured up ta keep ya in line!

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Ron

You been hanging around Carton Pearson to long.
Good to know there is nothing to be saved from & that hell was just conjured up ta keep ya in line!

Who is Carton Pearson, never meet him?
Brother, we are saved from the penalty of sin, and that is death, if Jesus had not died we would have died and that would be the end of it.

Adam brought it in by himself (with a little help from Eve), Jesus took it out by himself.

[Shawn]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

If this man had just only walked in the light of what he had known, of what he may have been exposed to, his chances of committing suicide would have been greatly diminished.


I guess when 9/11 happened, the thought of God never seized his heart, even for a brief moment, while the rest of the country looking for answers poured into churches all around.

I guess he was NEVER invited to Sunday School.

The "door knockers" always skipped his house.
God hid him from the street witnessers.
He NEVER drove by a church and when he did, he never saw the sign.


I am not being light with this man's untilmely demise.
However, our just and merciful God extended His hands to this man, like he does all and this man simply decided to do things on his own.

There isn't any way a person can convince me that there is an American adult who has NEVER been invited to a church. I can not be convinced that this grown American adult never drove by a church and never had not one Christian in his life.

If all he ever knew were Baptists, at least they are Christians with a relationship with God. However, the tragedy here is that this man probably rejected any and all Christian influence.

So he crumbled under te weight of his tragic life, when the whole time God was there to help him- but he rejected God's help.

So as a Christian, in light of God's Holy Word, the argument that this guy NEVER HAD A CHANCE IS IMPOSSIBLE!!!

Jesus told us to love those who hate and persecute us. Do you think Jesus would not comfort this man, in spite.



'If all he ever knew were Baptists, at least they are Christians with a relationship with God'.....

Not according to many on this forum.

[Esther]

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind

another definition of everlasting is "age-long". people in hell will suffer an age-long punishment. when the age-long punishment is over, people in hell will be redeemed. imo

What scripture do you have to back up this belief?

[Esther]

Originally Posted by crakjak

"of the next age" "aionion" "the life of the age to come" "the punishment of the age to come"

Related to punishment it does not mean without end. Pertaining to the life that comes from God, it is without end for only one reason it is the life of
God. Punishment by it's very nature serves a purpose and then ceases, unless you believe God to be punitive in His treatment of those created in His own image.

Is there a scripture you use to back up this belief?