Done right, it could be good. I don't see it being done right in the majority of cases, though. A pastor in my youth started this, but for some reason it never really got off the ground.
Are you being serious? there is no right way to do this.
Any minister that is allowing this to be done to him / for him ought to slapped in the face till he comes to his senses.
I have heard of this practice before and have always thought that it was shameful.
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God has lavished his love upon me.
Are you being serious? there is no right way to do this.
Any minister that is allowing this to be done to him / for him ought to slapped in the face till he comes to his senses.
I have heard of this practice before and have always thought that it was shameful.
I dunno, FAL. In the manner in which it has been described so far, I agree it's shameful.
But what if you have an elderly pastor, say, who is in high demand as a national and conference speaker, he has difficulty carrying luggage and needs an extra bit of help updating his blog and doing other church communications related work?
If "it's done right" - that is, if a talented assistant is paid a decent salary and given the respect they deserve - that they've earned! - then I don't see a problem.
I knew one pastor who had eyesight problems and always seemed to have some one at his arm to help him find his way into and out of large meeting halls. The problem he ran into was that though he seemed to appreciate the help, he was also generally something of a grouch at other times so he cycled through his informal "armor bearers" with some rapidity.
"Done right" is an ambiguous phrase. Maybe we should say - "Done with a sense of honor and mutual respect..." and if a full or even part time position - "Done with reasonable and adequate compensation."
I have seen a number of pastors and their wives implement the position of the armour bear. These people stand guard for them, run errands, pray for them, provide a spiritual barrier between them and the devils tactics sent from outsiders, prepare meals and drinks, wipe sweat, pack luggages for trips etc.
Is this position biblical and necessary? What does the scripture say about this? Or do we see this as an "errand boy/girl for the pastor?
What, no sedan chair?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
I understand what you're saying, and I don't disagree that it could be misused, and I'm not really even trying to defend the practice in general. However, if a pastor really has the heart of a servant, and he wants his "flunkies" as someone so eloquently called them to develop the same, then he could train them that way. As I said, does it work that way most of the time? Probably not. But it can.
Train them to carry his Bible and water bottle?!
Give me a break.
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"Resolved: That all men should live to the glory of God. Resolved, secondly: That whether or not anyone else does, I will." ~Jonathan Edwards
"The only man who has the right to say he is justified by grace alone is the man who has left all to follow Christ." ~Dietrich Bonheoffer, The Cost of Discipleship
"Preachers who should be fishing for men are now too often fishing for compliments from men." ~Leonard Ravenhill
I dunno, FAL. In the manner in which it has been described so far, I agree it's shameful.
But what if you have an elderly pastor, say, who is in high demand as a national and conference speaker, he has difficulty carrying luggage and needs an extra bit of help updating his blog and doing other church communications related work?
If "it's done right" - that is, if a talented assistant is paid a decent salary and given the respect they deserve - that they've earned! - then I don't see a problem.
I knew one pastor who had eyesight problems and always seemed to have some one at his arm to help him find his way into and out of large meeting halls. The problem he ran into was that though he seemed to appreciate the help, he was also generally something of a grouch at other times so he cycled through his informal "armor bearers" with some rapidity.
"Done right" is an ambiguous phrase. Maybe we should say - "Done with a sense of honor and mutual respect..." and if a full or even part time position - "Done with reasonable and adequate compensation."
This is basically what I had in mind - too bad people didn't see that. I was at work and couldn't give a more detailed response.
Last edited by seguidordejesus; 03-02-2010 at 06:55 PM.
No, seriously... After the last spate of church shootings I have heard of churches that have off duty police and others carry their weapons to church to serve as "armor bearers" to protect the people gathered there.
The church in Colorado Spgs. where that nut went around and killed a couple of kids in the parking lot already had such a program in place. It was one of the "armor bearers" that put the guy down before he could shoot anyone inside the church.
No, seriously... After the last spate of church shootings I have heard of churches that have off duty police and others carry their weapons to church to serve as "armor bearers" to protect the people gathered there.
The church in Colorado Spgs. where that nut went around and killed a couple of kids in the parking lot already had such a program in place. It was one of the "armor bearers" that put the guy down before he could shoot anyone inside the church.
Well in that case... no.
We did have the city police chief come to our church and walk us through some senarios... and how we should act.
But no one at our church has a concealed weapons license.
I dunno, FAL. In the manner in which it has been described so far, I agree it's shameful.
But what if you have an elderly pastor, say, who is in high demand as a national and conference speaker, he has difficulty carrying luggage and needs an extra bit of help updating his blog and doing other church communications related work?
If "it's done right" - that is, if a talented assistant is paid a decent salary and given the respect they deserve - that they've earned! - then I don't see a problem.
I knew one pastor who had eyesight problems and always seemed to have some one at his arm to help him find his way into and out of large meeting halls. The problem he ran into was that though he seemed to appreciate the help, he was also generally something of a grouch at other times so he cycled through his informal "armor bearers" with some rapidity.
"Done right" is an ambiguous phrase. Maybe we should say - "Done with a sense of honor and mutual respect..." and if a full or even part time position - "Done with reasonable and adequate compensation."
Agreed Pel. But why then call it an armour bearer? Call the person what he is, an assistant.
The title "armour bearer" is right up there with "holy magic hair" as something that gives off the wrong impression.
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God has lavished his love upon me.
A paid assistant is a much different thing than an armor bearer in the sense that it is used in many places today.
Like I said, I hope that what I've seen is worse than what transpires in most places.
Same church did supposedly do conceal and carry. Scary, and this is why. A woman told me she was so glad the men were carrying guns to church. When my reaction was less than positive, she told me that they were all well trained to handle weapons. I asked why she thought they were, or how she knew. She laughed and told me one had dropped his ammo running the aisles. Wait... she had just said this guy was well trained? I think I'd rather take my chances with the criminals...
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What we make of the Bible will never be as great a thing as what the Bible will - if we let it - make of us.~Rich Mullins
I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.~Galileo Galilei
I think I'd rather take my chances with the criminals...
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