So, then if "we" didn't take prayer out of the schools, who, or what did?
Nobody.
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Because the Lord's prayer is not said anymore during announcements
Staff-led prayer has ended.
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Teachers are not allowed to publicly pray with their children, or even teach the basic ten commandments to the children.
Yes, I believe you are correct. Nor can they teach any other religious tenets. Would you change that? Would your religion be the only one allowed to be taught? Would prayer to your God be the one teachers are allowed to pray?
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Timmy, do you think there could be a "coincidence" here, or more than a coincidence that these terrible mass school shootings started AFTER God and prayer were legislated out of the schools?
There may or may not be a cause/effect here, but my guess is no. Teacher-led prayer would not have prevented this tragedy any more than prayer in churches would have prevented the church shootings.
Some people are evil. Pure and simple. God never stops them. Never has and never will.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
I agree that evil reigns in our world. There are and have been evil people in the world, ever since Adam, Eve and Cain and Abel.
The reason God doesn't stop evil is the same reason He didn't stop Eve from eating of the tree of good and evil. He could have stopped her, you know.
But He didn't. He made the choice then to allow us to have our own free will.. and from the moment Eve made her decision.... humanity has been making choices since.
Those choices result in evil....
However, God showed us another way in the life of Christ. A way that works. Yet it is a way that most don't want to have anything to do with. It is called surrendering our will to HIS will. When we surrender our will to His, something remarkable can happen in our lives, when the supernatural takes residence in a human heart.
A surrendered will to Christ accomplishes much more good.... than a human will surrendered to no one but himself.
So, God has given us a choice. We can choose eternal life through Christ by surrendering our will to His, or we can continue on doing things our way, and live with the consequences of sin and death.
Evil is not God's choice. It is your choice, and mine to make.
Would you rather God had stopped Eve from eating of the tree of good and evil? Made us all basically like the angels with no ability to choose? No ability to rationalize or decide?
Or, would you rather that God left it an open thing... choice? Our choice to choose between good and evil.... ?
I agree that evil reigns in our world. There are and have been evil people in the world, ever since Adam, Eve and Cain and Abel.
The reason God doesn't stop evil is the same reason He didn't stop Eve from eating of the tree of good and evil. He could have stopped her, you know.
But He didn't. He made the choice then to allow us to have our own free will.. and from the moment Eve made her decision.... humanity has been making choices since.
Those choices result in evil....
However, God showed us another way in the life of Christ. A way that works. Yet it is a way that most don't want to have anything to do with. It is called surrendering our will to HIS will. When we surrender our will to His, something remarkable can happen in our lives, when the supernatural takes residence in a human heart.
A surrendered will to Christ accomplishes much more good.... than a human will surrendered to no one but himself.
So, God has given us a choice. We can choose eternal life through Christ by surrendering our will to His, or we can continue on doing things our way, and live with the consequences of sin and death.
Evil is not God's choice. It is your choice, and mine to make.
Would you rather God had stopped Eve from eating of the tree of good and evil? Made us all basically like the angels with no ability to choose? No ability to rationalize or decide?
Or, would you rather that God left it an open thing... choice? Our choice to choose between good and evil.... ?
Everyone would be better off if there was no evil. It is NOT true that good cannot exist without evil, as some try to say. If you are one of them, then explain what heaven will be like. Will there be good there? Will there be evil? Will there be "free choice"?
Nothing you said above addresses the question of "prayer in school", and how that related to the shooting last week. At least, it doesn't connect them in any cause/effect way.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
I am sure that someone could make a pretty lengthy list of bad things that happened to kids during the school day in the era when institutionalized prayer was present there.
I am sure that someone could make a pretty lengthy list of bad things that happened to kids during the school day in the era when institutionalized prayer was present there.
We could start with the embarrassment of having your name called over the intercom system to go to the principal's office. That was never a good thing.
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If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
We could start with the embarrassment of having your name called over the intercom system to go to the principal's office. That was never a good thing.
I remember that always being a big ?. You didn't know if you were in trouble or your parents were there to take you away.
I remember that always being a big ?. You didn't know if you were in trouble or your parents were there to take you away.
Either way, it was usually a bad thing.
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
I'm not saying that simply because prayer was taken out of our schools that all of a sudden these things are happening because of that one reason.
Prayer taken out of our schools is simply just one of the symptoms of the disease that is wrong with our country.
However, when prayer and any mention of God became effectively removed from the schools, we did begin to see much more violence begin to take place, and the form of these mass killings is one of them. These are symptoms of a greater problem, of course.
Prayer and God taken out of the schools is a simply a symptom of the condition of the hearts of the people of America. There are many, many other symptoms we could point to .... abortion legalized in 1973 with 53 million babies murdered since Roe vs Wade.... being another symptom of a nation who has lost sight of right from wrong.... that's 2000 babies murdered EVERY day here in America....
I'm not saying that simply because prayer was taken out of our schools that all of a sudden these things are happening because of that one reason.
Prayer taken out of our schools is simply just one of the symptoms of the disease that is wrong with our country.
However, when prayer and any mention of God became effectively removed from the schools, we did begin to see much more violence begin to take place, and the form of these mass killings is one of them. These are symptoms of a greater problem, of course.
Prayer and God taken out of the schools is a simply a symptom of the condition of the hearts of the people of America. There are many, many other symptoms we could point to .... abortion legalized in 1973 with 53 million babies murdered since Roe vs Wade.... being another symptom of a nation who has lost sight of right from wrong.... that's 2000 babies murdered EVERY day here in America....
What do you think of James Dobson's and others' remarks, saying that God is punishing America for its evil, such as abortion and redefining marriage?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
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