The New Testament church faced greater dangers than we do... they didn't equip men with swords to protect themselves. They saw Christ's words as being a commandment. They had a high regard for the Word of God and sought to obey it... even if it meant enduring tragedy and/or death.
“But God said unto me, Thou shalt not build an
house for my name, because thou hast been a man of
war, and hast shed blood” (I Chronicles 28:3).
“But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but
whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to
him the other also. . . . Love your enemies, bless them
that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and
pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute
you” (Matthew 5:39, 44).
“Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they
that take the sword shall perish with the sword” (Matthew
26:52).
“And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying,
And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do
violence to no man” (Luke 3:14).
"But that we write unto them, that they abstain
from pollutions of idols, and from fornication,
and from things strangled, and from blood."
(Acts 15:20).
“For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war
after the flesh: (For the weapons of our warfare are
not carnal)” (II Corinthians 10:3-4).
“For we wrestle not against flesh and blood”
(Ephesians 6:12).
“Ye have condemned and killed the just; and he
doth not resist you” (James 5:6).
I think it shows how little the modern church regards the teachings of Jesus and the true cost of being a Christian. Jesus never promised that it would be safe being a Christian, in fact he promised that it wouldn't be safe. Why doesn't this preacher begin preaching the Word of God and remind his church about the cost of being a follower of Jesus in a sinful and violent world?
"Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any
man will come after me, let him deny himself,
and take up his cross, and follow me."
(Matthew 16:24).
"Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted,
and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all
nations for my name's sake." (Matthew 24:9)
"They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time
cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he
doeth God service." (John 16:2)
In times like these we need to turn to the Word. Spelled W-O-R-D not S-W-O-R-D.
What should have happened on Sunday, December 9, 2007, when Matthew Murray stormed into New Life Church, determined to kill as many Christians as he could? What did happen is a church security guard shot him. She stopped him from killing any more people. You think she was wrong to shoot him? You think God counts it as sin?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
What should have happened on Sunday, December 9, 2007, when Matthew Murray stormed into New Life Church, determined to kill as many Christians as he could? What did happen is a church security guard shot him. She stopped him from killing any more people. You think she was wrong to shoot him? You think God counts it as sin?
Sgt York reckoned he was saving lives by taking it from those whos was doin the killin.
Sgt York reckoned he was saving lives by taking it from those whos was doin the killin.
Interestingly enough Murry inflicted the fatal shot to himself.
You'll notice that the guard didn't kill the assailant, but only seriously wounded him. In addition four people died anyway. And in the end Murry killed himself.
So, having a guard didn't prevent the tragedy. It may be argued that she prevented more people from dying (and I agree for the most part)... however, her shots didn't succeed in killing him.
In a way, I can see the hand of God here. God wouldn't let her kill him. Had the devil in Murry not won over and had Murry kill himself, I think God may have continued to reach for the boy through a prison ministry.
But it boils down to this. Either we live according to situational ethics or the teachings of Jesus. Why did Jesus rebuke his armed security guard?
What should have happened on Sunday, December 9, 2007, when Matthew Murray stormed into New Life Church, determined to kill as many Christians as he could? What did happen is a church security guard shot him. She stopped him from killing any more people. You think she was wrong to shoot him? You think God counts it as sin?
I have a question.
Was the security guard a licensed peace officer?
If so, it wasn't a sin. She had delegated authority from the government to use lethal force if necessary. We might be able to argue the ethics from a Christian perspective all day long... but if she was a licensed peace officer she has not sinned.
Now from a Christian perspective... where was she when Stephen was being stoned? Can you provide at least one example of a Christian using lethal force in the New Testament? They faced more serious dangers than we do.
Apparently not. "Former police officer" is how news stories describe her. However, she had a license to carry a weapon. She later said "I was praying and asking the Holy Spirit the entire time to guide me."
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If so, it wasn't a sin. She had delegated authority from the government to use lethal force if necessary. We might be able to argue the ethics from a Christian perspective all day long... but if she was a licensed peace officer she has not sinned.
Now from a Christian perspective... where was she when Stephen was being stoned? Can you provide at least one example of a Christian using lethal force in the New Testament? They faced more serious dangers than we do.
So again, what should have happened that Sunday morning? Should there have been many more Stephens? Murray was carrying two hand guns, an assault rifle, and a thousand rounds in clips.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
Apparently not. "Former police officer" is how news stories describe her. However, she had a license to carry a weapon. She later said "I was praying and asking the Holy Spirit the entire time to guide me."
So again, what should have happened that Sunday morning? Should there have been many more Stephens? Murray was carrying two hand guns, an assault rifle, and a thousand rounds in clips.
Timmy... sometimes obeying Jesus comes with a high cost.
Now, if she wasn't licensed by the government as a peace officer charged with enforcing the law she has sinned. She needs to seek God's grace. However, I wouldn't charge her with a crime (that's a civil matter). If she refuses to repent and imagines that what she did was the will of Jesus, even though she knows Jesus would have never called her to do such a thing, she'll loose her soul.
Timmy... sometimes obeying Jesus comes with a high cost.
Now, if she wasn't licensed by the government as a peace officer charged with enforcing the law she has sinned. She needs to seek God's grace. However, I wouldn't charge her with a crime (that's a civil matter). If she refuses to repent and imagines that what she did was the will of Jesus, even though she knows Jesus would have never called her to do such a thing, she'll loose her soul.
So, I think what you are saying is that Jesus wasn't happy with what happened. There should have been more deaths that morning. He wanted more people to pay that high cost of obedience you mention.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
So, I think what you are saying is that Jesus wasn't happy with what happened. There should have been more deaths that morning. He wanted more people to pay that high cost of obedience you mention.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
That and the apparent idea that Government should be the sole protector.
(And I am not sure who coined it here first but the term "Peace officer" really hits a raw nerve in me.)
That and the apparent idea that Government should be the sole protector.
Randy, the Word of God (certainly you know what that is) clearly states that government has the God ordained authority to use the sword. It is written,
Romans 13:1-4
1Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
So Randy, if you have an issue with government being ordained of God to punish evil and use the sword... you're issue isn't with me because of what I'm saying... but with the Word of God.
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(And I am not sure who coined it here first but the term "Peace officer" really hits a raw nerve in me.)
Randy, the term "Peace Officer" is a legal term referring to one licensed by the government (God's ordained avenger) to enforce the Law and reign in criminal activity. From the Free Online Dictionary,
peace officer
n.
A law enforcement officer, such as a sheriff, who is responsible for maintaining civil peace.
So, I think what you are saying is that Jesus wasn't happy with what happened. There should have been more deaths that morning. He wanted more people to pay that high cost of obedience you mention.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Timmy,
What I'm saying is; Jesus calls us to obedience to his commandments no matter what the cost.
Hybrid Mode
