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  #11  
Old 05-24-2011, 07:46 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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Originally Posted by seekerman View Post
When you said you could save a child from an oncoming train, but didn't, that's exercising your free will. It's your choice.
OK, so you missed my point.

God watches children get killed in accidents, every day. Just watches. Could stop it, but doesn't. (At least, not in all cases.) But God is good.

If I stood by and watched a child get hit by a train, when I could easily have prevented it, what would you say about me?
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  #12  
Old 05-24-2011, 07:53 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

My wife's step mother prayed for protection of all her children and step children, every day. Think it worked? Well, maybe God would have liked to protect her and her siblings from that man's free will, but sadly, He couldn't. They were molested by this family friend and pillar of the church, for years.

God must love free will more than he loved those kids.
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  #13  
Old 05-24-2011, 07:55 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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Old 05-24-2011, 07:56 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
OK, so you missed my point.

God watches children get killed in accidents, every day. Just watches. Could stop it, but doesn't. (At least, not in all cases.) But God is good.

If I stood by and watched a child get hit by a train, when I could easily have prevented it, what would you say about me?
Nope, not the same thing.

Once again, God is the creator of the system in which we live. He's not part of the everyday events, they're products of nature, laws and free will choices by individuals.

You, as a part of the free will system would be accountable in your decision, not God.
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  #15  
Old 05-24-2011, 07:58 PM
seekerman seekerman is offline
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Re: Is God in control?

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Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
My wife's step mother prayed for protection of all her children and step children, every day. Think it worked? Well, maybe God would have liked to protect her and her siblings from that man's free will, but sadly, He couldn't. They were molested by this family friend and pillar of the church, for years.

God must love free will more than he loved those kids.
You're saying that life should be perfect, with God making us do the 'right' thing each and every time. That's not free will.
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  #16  
Old 05-24-2011, 08:08 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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Nope, not the same thing.

Once again, God is the creator of the system in which we live. He's not part of the everyday events, they're products of nature, laws and free will choices by individuals.

You, as a part of the free will system would be accountable in your decision, not God.
I understand. God can even kill children, and still be thought of as good. In fact, he demands that we think he is good, no matter what he does. So, if we read a newspaper account of a... well, I was going to say a crime, but let's not pass judgement, just yet. Here, let's dive into a (made-up) example:
An unknown individual broke into a daycare center yesterday, and opened fire with an assault weapon, killing all the children and workers present. Investigators have no idea of the identity of the individual
That's all we know. From just this account, can you tell me whether the action of this individual was good or evil?
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  #17  
Old 05-24-2011, 08:09 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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Originally Posted by seekerman View Post
You're saying that life should be perfect, with God making us do the 'right' thing each and every time. That's not free will.
That's not what I'm saying, and you still haven't gotten my point. I don't think you want to.
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  #18  
Old 05-24-2011, 08:22 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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I understand. God can even kill children, and still be thought of as good. In fact, he demands that we think he is good, no matter what he does. So, if we read a newspaper account of a... well, I was going to say a crime, but let's not pass judgement, just yet. Here, let's dive into a (made-up) example:
An unknown individual broke into a daycare center yesterday, and opened fire with an assault weapon, killing all the children and workers present. Investigators have no idea of the identity of the individual
That's all we know. From just this account, can you tell me whether the action of this individual was good or evil?
Brother, I understand your struggle, really I do. I don't particularly like the system at times either. The fact is though, God doesn't choose to intervene in His system each and every time a wrong is about to be committed. You may not like that, I may not like that, but that's the way it is.
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  #19  
Old 05-24-2011, 08:23 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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That's not what I'm saying, and you still haven't gotten my point. I don't think you want to.
Oh, I think I've gotten your point. You don't like God's system. Well, neither do I sometimes.
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  #20  
Old 05-24-2011, 08:27 PM
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Re: Is God in control?

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Brother, I understand your struggle, really I do. I don't particularly like the system at times either. The fact is though, God doesn't choose to intervene in His system each and every time a wrong is about to be committed. You may not like that, I may not like that, but that's the way it is.
I have no struggle!

Can you answer the question about the daycare shooting?
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