Even though our pastor, Chandler, will hang out with pentecostals and charismatics he would probably consider most of them to be practicing the gifts in an unbiblical way and leading people into mysticism. There is so much of that going around.
Still, these guys aren't your typical calvinist in that they do agree that in the proper context the gifts are to be used in the church today.
What you say is true. Most Reformed charismatics would not want to endorse the excessive, prosperity gospel, word-of-faith pentecostals. And that is a good thing because, as you say, there is a lot of mystic, unbiblical stuff going around.
But we still need to be careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
As Sam Storms, a well-known reformed charismatic, says, "The eleventh commandment is not 'Thou shalt not do at all what others do poorly.'"
In other words, just because some people abuse the charismatic gifts does NOT mean that the gifts should be thrown out altogether. That's basically the message of 1 Corinthians.
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"If I find in myself a desire which no experience in this world can satisfy, the most probable explanation is that I was made for another world." - C.S. Lewis
What you say is true. Most Reformed charismatics would not want to endorse the excessive, prosperity gospel, word-of-faith pentecostals. And that is a good thing because, as you say, there is a lot of mystic, unbiblical stuff going around.
But we still need to be careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
As Sam Storms, a well-known reformed charismatic, says, "The eleventh commandment is not 'Thou shalt not do at all what others do poorly.'"
In other words, just because some people abuse the charismatic gifts does NOT mean that the gifts should be thrown out altogether. That's basically the message of 1 Corinthians.
I think I agree. However, there are some, mainly pentecostals, who may say that because there is a stance against the idea of "the baptism with the evidence of speaking in other tongues" that they are throwing everything out.
I can attest that the miraculous is happening everyday at our church. People are healed, lives are changed, and yet all this is done without shouting music, altar calls, or any of the other stuff that pentecostals are well known for. It is hard to explain the church and I think it is so rare that there isn't much to compare it with out there. Hopefully that will change, The Village has planted seven churches in the area and begging people to leave there church and go because there is no room at church anymore.
The ONE thing that happens to EVERY person who becomes a Christian; "Let the FINGER POINTING BEGIN". Religion opens the door to the secret violence that is in every person’s heart, where we defend ideas of uncertainty with unproven facts!
I don't care what Faith or Denomination you belong to, when you are accepted into a belief system that is based upon the Bible, prepare yourself for Religious WAR! Your Faith will pat you on the back as long as you follow the Creed, but say a word against that Faith and watch the swords draw!
Everyone thinks they are RIGHT about things they know nothing of! Trinnies hate the Oneness people, and Oneness people hate the Trinnies...blah, blah, blah...It's time to laugh at our calamity of pure, undefiled ignorance!
No one on this Forum can honestly say, “I know who God really is!” We formulate Scripture to validate our idea, while someone else is doing the EXACT same thing, but with a different idea! The Jews, who apparently loved the God of Old, don’t even call God a “He”, yet we claim we are spiritual Jews. This argument will never end unless we humble out and admit that humans will never comprehend the immensity of a Being that speaks galaxies into existence!
Gal 3:20 (KJV)
Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
Gal 3:20 (AMP)
Now a go-between (intermediary) has to do with and implies more than one party [there can be no mediator with just one person]. Yet God is [only] one Person [and He was the sole party in giving that promise to Abraham.
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...Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ...(Acts 20:21)
I don't think so at all. In human experience it does of course.
God incarnate, through willing submission, can intercede and communicate with God transcendent and beyond humanity.
I believe there is One Person of God.
__________________ "It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
OK, not exactly. But is it really much different? You have One Person, in two manifestaions or offices. That One Person in one manifestation talking to another manifestation of Himself. How is that Person not speaking to Himself?
He is! But when we compare that with ourselves doing similar things, it totally changes the picture. We are not REQUIRED to talk to ourselves as God manifested in flesh as a genuine human that has to pray is required to. We are one person with one nature. God is not restricted to us. So you are actually, though I do not think you see it, making what would look ridiculous for us to do something that therefore must be ridiculous for God to do.
No one seems to get my point. lol. Whatever. I have been trying to relate how we have to stop comparing God manifested in TWO DIFFERENT NATURES with two human beings who each have ONE NATURE. It's the most grand case of apples opposed to oranges there could be! God is not limited to one nature as we are, and therefore all bets are off as to what He cannot do as one person in contrast to us. It is utterly absurd to think God must be more than one person because one human person who possesses only one nature, and such a state can never change, cannot do certain things God did without being more than one person.
__________________ ...MY THOUGHTS, ANYWAY.
"Many Christians do not try to understand what was written in a verse in the Bible. Instead they approach the passage to prove what they already believe."
I don't think so at all. In human experience it does of course.
God incarnate, through willing submission, can intercede and communicate with God transcendent and beyond humanity.
I believe there is One Person of God.
Hoovie sees it!
__________________ ...MY THOUGHTS, ANYWAY.
"Many Christians do not try to understand what was written in a verse in the Bible. Instead they approach the passage to prove what they already believe."
I don't think so at all. In human experience it does of course.
God incarnate, through willing submission, can intercede and communicate with God transcendent and beyond humanity.
I believe there is One Person of God.
Hey Hoovie, isn't that what Gal 3:20 is saying, right?
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...Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ...(Acts 20:21)
Hey Hoovie, isn't that what Gal 3:20 is saying, right?
It does say "Yet God is [only] one Person" in the AMP. I did not know that. That's very interesting.
__________________ "It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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