Are all Catholics lost?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by shazeep

my meaning @ "it's you" is that your views reflect upon you, not them, just to clarify.

Your examples of aparables of salvation I found to not be about salvation at all, though.


then believe that, if that is what you believe. I am not trying to change your beliefs. However, you might address God allows all to be deceived now, that all can be saved in the end paraphrased; your position sounds a lot like "I am not deceived, and all cannot be saved." And i have about like 50 others, Mike.

I never once said I cannot be deceived, and nothing I stated implies that. All I have ever stated is the word of God is the judge and when plain statements are made, like faith in the cross being an absolute for salvation, and that faith lacks, that has nothing to do with me being deceived or not. Why keeping making it about me? That puzzles me more than anything.

the cross has to be involved and nothing can equate or replace it.

pray tell how you might more completely involve the cross, then.

It's so much more simpler than what makes you ask that. If one has no faith in anything one could do, and solely trusts God's efforts of the cross to remit sins and free us of the debt of sin, which is death, then that's it. Apply that the way the apostles taught people to apply it in Acts, and, voila! Done!

His agape love is too far beyond any we could have.

? Believe what you will, then, but i would say this is a good focal point. This is like my 5th try at an answer here--specifically, in this spot--and the other 4 would not serve you, i don't think, so maybe someone else might weigh in on this.

It is precisley the focal point of our differences, now that' we've discussed more.

My view, and I know you aren't trying to change it (and it's moot to say you are or aren't, so you don't have to do so), is that God's love through the cross cannot be equated to anything else, so nothing else can save us. Any inkling that it can is salvation by works.

You call them "clues" when you see a chance for crossless salvation. And when really pinned about certain verses, you say you do not know. That's fine, but you cannot make a dogma out of the concept that there is a crossless salvation as you seemingly have. Not only that, it can, and I think it has, stopped you from reaching out to people like muslims about the cross. That's the danger I see here.

Put it this way, if God saves someone aside from the cross, His word simply doesn't give indication of it. And all your attempts at scriptures to indicate He might, simply are not even talking about salvation, as I have emphasized quite a lot. And He's certainly able to do what He feels to do.

You never answered how fulfilling law means salvation.