POA Use Idol Worship at Campmeeting?

[Polaris]

AMEN! You have to draw the line somewhere. What's next? Ave Maria at the General Conference?

Originally Posted by stmatthew

The point is not that a song is written by a trinitarian, but whether a song as trinitarian doctrine within it being sung in UPCI churches. Big difference to me. I can sing a song written by an atheist if it praises Jesus. But to sing a song that claims that the godhead is 3 in 1 is trinitarian false doctrine from my understanding, and I will not sing it.

[NLYP]

Originally Posted by Polaris

What is wrong with that, My dear brother, is that the man who wrote the song thinks God is three persons, and by saying "the Godhead, three in one, Father, Spirit, Son", he has in mind the triune God doctrine of three persons in the Godhead. And the PENTECOSTALS OF ALEXANDRIA sang THIS at the LA CAMPMEETING????????????????? I'm shocked. I'm floored. Somebody tell me that this is all one big mistake...please!

Nope...not a mistake....and they sang it at BOTT and the presence of God was UNREAL!
The worship was awesome.....NOT Alexandria people...BOTT Ministers...UPCI Ministers!

[NLYP]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Sad but true. It is sung at many UPCI churches.

MANY!!!!!!!!!!!
I have heard it in Ohio, Louisiana, Tennessee, Florida, Mississippi and Wisconsin.

[NLYP]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Godhead three in one to a Trinitarian might mean three persons but to Oneness it usually means three manifestations. Why is it ok to use the KJV, translated by Trinitarians, which has 1john 5:7, which most Trinitarians interpret to mean three persons.....

Even though we are told this verse is not even in the original, yet the UPC has not banned this book from use by Apostolics

My My Prax.....we agree!!!!!
Shall we celebrate???

[NLYP]

Originally Posted by Polaris

So they sang an overtly, completely blatant Trinitarian song at a major Oneness-church camp meeting, and people are wondering what the big deal is. This is awful. Just when I think I've heard it all.... Elder G. T. Haywood wrote some of our best-loved hymns. Have you ever noticed that the old AOG hymnbooks don't contain them? They also don't contain "The Water Way" or "All in Him". Naturally, they excluded them because they came out of the Oneness camp. Did you ever notice that the Trinitarians are not making changes in THEIR position to drift over toward OUR camp?

There has been a subtle trend in recent years to water down our doctrine, to "work for changes", and to try to play down the differences between Trinitarian and Oneness theology. If your view of the Godhead doesn't matter, then it also doesn't matter how you baptize...so the Apostolic plan of salvation isn't important anymore, either. Throw away standards of holiness while you're at it, too, just like they did. Next thing you know, we're all one big happy "church" where you can believe any way you want, be baptized any way you want, and nothing matters any more.

So where is this coming from? Of all of the many wonderful songs written and recorded in Apostolic Pentecost, why on earth would they take an overtly trinitarian song and perform it at a major Oneness camp meeting? I'm not making any accusations, but it does raise a question--does somebody have an agenda? Where are the elders? Who's minding the store? Just what WAS the spirit that Bro. Strange was sensing, and why aren't more people bothered by it? (I'm sure that this one song wasn't the only thing on his mind, but it might be indicative of a disturbing trend.)

Does anybody ever wonder how all of this affects the young people? They're going to grow up thinking, "what difference does it make? Trinity...Oneness...we're all saying the same thing, just using different ways to express it". Subtle, innocent-looking changes today snowball into major shifts tomorrow. Again, does it never occur to anyone that the trinitarians aren't emulating us and making subtle moves in OUR direction? THEY need what WE have...not the other way around. I'm deeply grieved.

Would you please give me just a small break!

The sky is falling....the sky is falling!!!!!!!!

[Barb]

Originally Posted by NLYP

MANY!!!!!!!!!!!
I have heard it in Ohio, Louisiana, Tennessee, Florida, Mississippi and Wisconsin.

It's not sung just in the UPCI...I was in an ALJC church a few weeks ago and it was sung.

I am Oneness to the bone and sang the song...I know who the Father, Son and Holy Ghost is, and His Name is Jesus!!

Don't have a problem with it, and with SO many other things not right with the Church today, why we are even debating whether lyrics are Oneness enough or not blows my mind...and the exact same discussion over this song is going on over at GNC...amazing!!

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

But Prax,

It is not even three manifestations in one. The Word IS Jesus, not just dwelling IN him.

Hmmm...I know a LOT of Oneness that DO believe in three manifestations, FAther, Son and Holy Ghost, that are all three the One God. Three in One. What do you think Trinitarians mean when they say "three in one"?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

The point is not that a song is written by a trinitarian, but whether a song as trinitarian doctrine within it being sung in UPCI churches. Big difference to me. I can sing a song written by an atheist if it praises Jesus. But to sing a song that claims that the godhead is 3 in 1 is trinitarian false doctrine from my understanding, and I will not sing it.

He's God in the Father. He's God in the Son. He's God in the HOly Ghost and all these three are one...Im sure a Trinitarian can agree with that. Trinitarians and OPs believe in a lot of the same doctrines. We can sing their songs in our church when they say "God" or even One God, and have no problem would we? The difference that has always been between Oneness and Trinity is really more about how we DEFINE such terms. We both believe in Father, Son and Holy Ghost. We both believe in One God. We both believe Jesus is God.

So short of a song that says "blessed Trinity", when we sing these other songs we have a different view of what "Godhead" and "three in one" is from the

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Polaris

So they sang an overtly, completely blatant Trinitarian song at a major Oneness-church camp meeting, and people are wondering what the big deal is. This is awful. Just when I think I've heard it all.... Elder G. T. Haywood wrote some of our best-loved hymns. Have you ever noticed that the old AOG hymnbooks don't contain them? They also don't contain "The Water Way" or "All in Him". Naturally, they excluded them because they came out of the Oneness camp. Did you ever notice that the Trinitarians are not making changes in THEIR position to drift over toward OUR camp?

There has been a subtle trend in recent years to water down our doctrine, to "work for changes", and to try to play down the differences between Trinitarian and Oneness theology. If your view of the Godhead doesn't matter, then it also doesn't matter how you baptize...so the Apostolic plan of salvation isn't important anymore, either. Throw away standards of holiness while you're at it, too, just like they did. Next thing you know, we're all one big happy "church" where you can believe any way you want, be baptized any way you want, and nothing matters any more.

So where is this coming from? Of all of the many wonderful songs written and recorded in Apostolic Pentecost, why on earth would they take an overtly trinitarian song and perform it at a major Oneness camp meeting? I'm not making any accusations, but it does raise a question--does somebody have an agenda? Where are the elders? Who's minding the store? Just what WAS the spirit that Bro. Strange was sensing, and why aren't more people bothered by it? (I'm sure that this one song wasn't the only thing on his mind, but it might be indicative of a disturbing trend.)

Does anybody ever wonder how all of this affects the young people? They're going to grow up thinking, "what difference does it make? Trinity...Oneness...we're all saying the same thing, just using different ways to express it". Subtle, innocent-looking changes today snowball into major shifts tomorrow. Again, does it never occur to anyone that the trinitarians aren't emulating us and making subtle moves in OUR direction? THEY need what WE have...not the other way around. I'm deeply grieved.

You must not have noticed but they actually have been and still do sing songs written by Oneness Pentecostals

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by NLYP

Would you please give me just a small break!

The sky is falling....the sky is falling!!!!!!!!