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  #161  
Old 09-04-2007, 05:05 PM
Newman Newman is offline
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Originally Posted by mizpeh View Post
Yet, Paul gives leeway in Rom 14. He can eat all meat but a weaker brother believes otherwise. They aren't speaking the same thing. But there are other principles involved:toleration, love, and putting the other first.
Indeed.
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  #162  
Old 09-11-2007, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea View Post
Posted on NewChurchOrder.com



Anthony Langston [NJ], UPCI minister and NCO member will be launching a new book entitled "Holier than God". I can't imagine he will be w/ the fellowship much longer.
--------------------------------------

HOLIER THAN GOD
Below are some snapshots of the upcoming doctrinal thesis on Biblical holiness (of life and outward appearance) by Anthony Langston.

A favorite text of the proponents of traditional positions in any denomination is,"Remove not the ancient landmarks of our fathers." �(Prov. 22:28)

The question begs asking, "Who are our the fathers?" Who are the fathers of the 20th -21st century Pentecostalism? Is it pastors from the 50's & 60's or district and national leaders?

Or is it men of the 20's and 30's who were flaming evangels, strafing the country with tent revivals and leaving in each of their wakes scores of churches and hundreds of Gospel preachers? Read the writings of these men and you'll be hard pressed to find much on the subject of what we call "standards." Rule-based "standards" became the focus of many from a later generation that lacked the power and effectiveness of their predecessors but compensated by "perfecting" the churches they inherited!


However, with that said, Howard Goss is not my doctrinal father. A.D. Urshan (who received the Holy Spirit while my wife's great aunt played the organ and her great grandmother prayed with him in the altar) or C.G. Weeks (who was a close personal friend and mentor of my wife's grandfather) or any other 20th or 19th century preacher does not qualify as a doctrinal father! If you allow this practice, then you can't argue it with other denominations who hold to their iconic elders and their teachings. No! Our doctrinal fathers can be none other than the Apostles, Prophets and Jesus Christ the Chief Cornerstone.

If you cite or hold to any teaching other than the Holy Scriptures as fundamental you are a traditionalist! I prefer to be a primitivist!
For all who say "our forefathers sorted these things out years ago" I would like to ask, have you shown the same courage and earnestness? Have you sorted them out? Or will you settle for the footnotes of someone else's study , prayer and struggle. Someone who was called to a different generation. These men and women were called to another time with very different challenges and with a truckload of their own traditional baggage already deep-seated in them from their 19th century Baptist, Pilgrim Holiness, Wesleyan or Puritan origins!

Do you really want to trace your positional interpretations back to people who burned witches and made transgressors wear scarlet letters for a year after letting them out of public stocks? I'm sorry if I sound extreme, but I'm weary with others attempting to root me in an "old fashioned, traditional, Americana Holiness." Would the Corinthian church have survived the puritan occupation? Or for that matter, could it belong to a mainstream apostolic organization? If you want to understand the Scriptures on subjects such as hair, jewelry, and clothing; you must look at it from the context of this world, not the Apostolic church. Come to my city where men dress like women and women like men, where young people wear enough metal piercings to build a compact car and tattoos are an essential accessory and then you will understand the point and need for these moral, moderate, and modesty principles based in Scripture. But what has happened, is that introverted churches and ministries have turned these Scriptures in on the already separated and righteous and have increasingly raised the bar (perhaps competitively) thus tweaking the issues so far out of perspective and beyond their original intent that many churches and believers are completely isolated and ineffective to their families and larger community. Some have progressed from a holy separateness to a cultish community of exclusion, and the devil is overjoyed!

The problem is not that I don't love holiness, the problem is that some love their standard and their tradition and the affirmation of goose bump clubs more than they love honesty, study, and simple Scriptural verity!

It is amazing to me how differently some scholars write about this subject as opposed to others such as, Baptism, Godhead, etc.. On other subjects they allow no traditionalists views to stand against the barrage of solid scriptural exegesis and hermeneutics. With the sword of Scripture as their only authority, they dismantle falsehoods and establish clear doctrine with multiple contextual witnesses. But when they write on the subject of "outward appearance," they adopt the habits and practices they abhor in others and with conjecture and opinion they stretch a verse beyond its simple truth and then move to another, thus establishing a philosophical buttress of circular reasoning! I've heard everything from, "even witches know this about hair" to "makeup is made from human embryos." Do yourself a favor, take every book you have on the subject, mark out with a thick black marker every sentence and paragraph that is not scripture or clear contextual and honest deciphering of Scripture and you will not be left with much to read!

I'm certainly not angry with these men and writers. I have myself spent too many years doing the same. I'm angry at falsehoods. Religious phariseeisms. I've put up with it for so long, too long. Its time to speak out, to tell the truth no matter the cost! Who am I to think my ministry should be without reproach or slander.
I have a cross to bear, perhaps this is part of it. I write this broken; broken in conviction and broken by the thought of friends I love not being able to receive these words. I concur with the hymnologist who said, "Must Jesus bear the cross alone and all the world go free, there is a cross for everyone and there is a cross for me."

I've had the privilege of watching and learning from new converts who fell in love with holiness through our teaching and seeing them persecuted by family and friends without ever experiencing the extreme version of (standards) that you and I have been subjected to. Don't believe the lie that there is no difference and that the redefiners are all worldly and not standing for anything. You just have to hear the testimonies in our discipleship community groups by these babies. My wife and I try not to laugh because we are thinking to ourselves, "Girl, you have no idea" but their separation is real! Their wardrobe is changing. Its costing them money to throw away clothes and buy different ones. They have been taught principles from the Scripture without traditional definitions and they really do love God enough and are honest enough to embrace the changes that Spirit-led principled living dictates! They really can be trusted to grow!
But that is the real problem isn't it. Trust ! If I don't believe in people then I can't trust them to grow. Therefore I must mandate change through standardized criteria's. The problem with this is that I have bypassed an essential process for them and replaced that process with product! Now I feel accomplished. I have product. I'm affirmed when my appraisers approve of the product. As a leader I am celebrated. But the people haven't transformed! No my friend, they have merely conformed! They did not come to it gradually and personally through the relational process with God. Their chance to "work out their own salvation" was stolen from them by the impatient hands of leadership, leaders more interested in bottom lines than spiritual growth.


The Apostles understood this in Acts 15, when they said, "we will put no greater burden on them than this." (Acts 15:28) But 35 years later in 1 Cor. 11, Paul is dealing with issues that were not in focus at the birth of these precious saints. Holiness is progressive.
BUMP FOR THE VICAR OF CHRIST.
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  #163  
Old 09-11-2007, 05:11 PM
Coonskinner Coonskinner is offline
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Originally Posted by mfblume View Post
Is this guy presently UPCI?
Yes he is.

I have known Tony Langston for around nine years, but haven't had contact with him for a while. He is one of the funniest guys to be around that you will ever meet, a lot of humor, and sharp.

It looks like he is about to achieve exit velocity though.
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  #164  
Old 09-11-2007, 05:20 PM
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RevDWW RevDWW is offline
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Originally Posted by Coonskinner View Post
Yes he is.

I have known Tony Langston for around nine years, but haven't had contact with him for a while. He is one of the funniest guys to be around that you will ever meet, a lot of humor, and sharp.

It looks like he is about to achieve exit velocity though.
You think he's going to break strain, overcome the UPCI gravitational field, and exit orbit?
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Psa 119:165 (KJV) 165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

"Do not believe everthing you read on the internet" - Abe Lincoln
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  #165  
Old 09-11-2007, 05:24 PM
Coonskinner Coonskinner is offline
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Originally Posted by RevDWW View Post
You think he's going to break strain, overcome the UPCI gravitational field, and exit orbit?
He's showing all the signs--especially the book writing.

All the guys who leave us tend to want to write books or letters explaining their newfound liberty.
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  #166  
Old 09-11-2007, 05:26 PM
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pelathais pelathais is offline
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Originally Posted by Coonskinner View Post
He's showing all the signs--especially the book writing.

All the guys who leave us tend to want to write books or letters explaining their newfound liberty.
Tony's been in and out before, though. He may have a heat shield like the shuttle. But even that burns up sometimes.
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  #167  
Old 09-11-2007, 06:58 PM
Coonskinner Coonskinner is offline
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Originally Posted by pelathais View Post
Tony's been in and out before, though. He may have a heat shield like the shuttle. But even that burns up sometimes.

Tony and I were sitting on the balcony at Chester Wright's in Annapolis about midnight one night, after a long, arduous day and night of fasting, praying, hearing Brother Wright teach, and being browbeaten by Johnny Garrison.

We were exhausted. We had probably logged 6-8 hours of prayer, and more than that of teaching.

We were on the third day of fasting...it was pretty brutal.

As we sat there and sipped coffee, Johnny Garrison was prancing around, still bright-eyed and bushy-tailed.

Tony stared balefully at Brother Garrison over the rim of his coffee cup, and said to me, "I'm hungry for more of God, and I want God to use me. But if that man tells me to pray one more time tonight, I'm going to spit on his shoes."

I nearly fell out laughing.
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  #168  
Old 09-11-2007, 07:02 PM
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RevDWW RevDWW is offline
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Originally Posted by Coonskinner View Post
Tony and I were sitting on the balcony at Chester Wright's in Annapolis about midnight one night, after a long, arduous day and night of fasting, praying, hearing Brother Wright teach, and being browbeaten by Johnny Garrison.

We were exhausted. We had probably logged 6-8 hours of prayer, and more than that of teaching.

We were on the third day of fasting...it was pretty brutal.

As we sat there and sipped coffee, Johnny Garrison was prancing around, still bright-eyed and bushy-tailed.

Tony stared balefully at Brother Garrison over the rim of his coffee cup, and said to me, "I'm hungry for more of God, and I want God to use me. But if that man tells me to pray one more time tonight, I'm going to spit on his shoes."

I nearly fell out laughing.
That was funny. My only question is, what were you guys doing drinking coffe while fasting????
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Psa 119:165 (KJV) 165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

"Do not believe everthing you read on the internet" - Abe Lincoln
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  #169  
Old 09-11-2007, 07:08 PM
Coonskinner Coonskinner is offline
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Originally Posted by RevDWW View Post
That was funny. My only question is, what were you guys doing drinking coffe while fasting????
Brother,

We stayed in the church all week long, locked in.

We were up praying all hours of the night and through the day, in between sessions of Brother Wright teaching. We slept very little.

It was so physically grueling that we drank coffee some of the time to help us stay a little focused.
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  #170  
Old 09-11-2007, 07:12 PM
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RevDWW RevDWW is offline
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Originally Posted by Coonskinner View Post
Brother,

We stayed in the church all week long, locked in.

We were up praying all hours of the night and through the day, in between sessions of Brother Wright teaching. We slept very little.

It was so physically grueling that we drank coffee some of the time to help us stay a little focused.
I wonder how much coffee Moses, Elijah and Jesus drank while fasting.............






Just messing with yah..........
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Psa 119:165 (KJV) 165 Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.

"Do not believe everthing you read on the internet" - Abe Lincoln
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