My point is less blunt than what you are seeing lol I disagree with myself in that case.... I don't feel that God would leave something vital to ambiguous interpretation... We can agree to disagree on hair and apparel and believe that these are not issues of salvation in all situations but when it comes to something as important as the formula for salvation I would be highly disappointed in the transparency of God's Word if it wasn't clearly stated and it was a requirement.
__________________ Everyone's Connected <-- Visit now and Easily Connect with your Facebook credentials!
Join EC, help make this site something worth its name. We need people to get on their and start discussion, post pictures, make and join groups! INVITE YOUR FRIENDS... ask me what I would do to get you to join and invite your friends!
1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
...
Couldn't we ask your question this way;
I don't want this to divert us from the original topic but I will explain briefly what I am hinting at...
If getting baptized is a requirement for salvation, it is the failure to do so that is the action of consequence... therefore intent of the action or reason cant be judged in the same fashion as some sort of sin that we would commit.
So all of the ideological and philosophical debates regarding death before one could be baptized or the physical inability are just fun, because this is quite different from a sin of omission... since the act is explicit and very clear as what to do.
So follow me here... if a man doesn't follow a symbolic path to express his faith does he not have faith?
What saving power is there in symbolism? Making the assumption that everyone in the Bible did it so I should just isn't a strong enough argument to say that it is a requirement....
Being born of water and of spirit is a requirement, maybe not the only but it is one.... just being here pretty much shows we have accomplished one of those-- So do we really need to be baptized to go to be saved?
I believe justification occurs at the moment of faith/repentance. What happens subsequently, including baptism, is the result of being born of God.
Rejection of baptism, or other things plainly taught in scripture, would be indicitive of one having something less than genuine faith. It is fair to question them, and they should expect resistance from the body they reject and refuse to identify with.
__________________ "It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
Hello, I know I'm new here and nobody knows me. I found this forum on Google and this was the newest thread, so I figured I'd jump in.
Have y'all considered this text?
1Pe 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
1Pe 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
1Pe 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
1Pe 3:22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.
Couldn't we ask your question this way;
Was the ark essential to Noah's salvation?
Anyway, hope it was OK to chime in.
This scripture does show how important baptism is in regards to saving from our guilty conscience.
When we recieve the work of Christ on the cross by faith, he does cleanse the filth and sins of the flesh, but when we make public proclamation through baptism it shows commitment and good conscience toward God.
__________________ "It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
My point is less blunt than what you are seeing lol I disagree with myself in that case.... I don't feel that God would leave something vital to ambiguous interpretation... We can agree to disagree on hair and apparel and believe that these are not issues of salvation in all situations but when it comes to something as important as the formula for salvation I would be highly disappointed in the transparency of God's Word if it wasn't clearly stated and it was a requirement.
What's clear to some may not be to others. We see what we want to see. I again agree with you, and I understand your question. My response is - I don't see conclusive evidence.
__________________
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it. — André Gide
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds... - Ralph Waldo Emerson
What's clear to some may not be to others. We see what we want to see. I again agree with you, and I understand your question. My response is - I don't see conclusive evidence.
Ya think?
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
You don't "clean yourself up" and then come to Jesus.
He calls and you come to Him because He's calling you to repentance.
You don't continue in sin. You strive to live a life pleasing to the Lord.
These are things that a Christian MUST DO.
It doesn't save you, but you do it because as a Christian, this is what you are instructed to do.
Just as the new believer MUST DEPART FROM SIN, that same new believer MUST BE BAPTIZED.
If for no other reason than obedience.
This is why the scripture in Peter about baptism saving us is important:
IF YOU HAVE A GOOD CONSCIENCE TOWARDS YOUR NEW LORD AND SAVIOR, YOU WILL DEMONSTRATE THAT BY OBEYING THE SCRIPTURES.
But you don't get baptized to get saved. I'm speaking to the intent of one's heart and the way the Gospel should be presented-- a way that does not encourage "performance pentecost" or legalism or anything that would suggest that somehow our actions saved us.
How do you look at Communion?
In your mind, does taking Communion save you?
bump
__________________
"The choices we make reveal the true nature of our character."
Linear Mode
