Tulsa Report Day 2

Originally Posted by Apprehended

Thanks for your response.

I certainly agree that they have a constitutional right.

Whatever happened to the principle of submission? Or whatever happend to the principle of "obey them that have the rule over you." Whatever happened to the idea of humility when everything does not go "MY" way?

If there are powers that are ordained of God, as all of these bretheren teach, what is so objectionable to submitting to that power? If we are going to CONTEND for the faith that was once delivered unto the saints, before whom are we going to contend...the world? No. We must contend for THAT faith before all of whom is departing from that faith.

Jude 4 makes that plain..."For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness..." Little good it does for preachers to preach to preachers who all preach the same thing, unless of course they are just trying to see who can strut the most and outdo each other.

Your prayer that God bless the Tulsa crowd is mine as well. Hopefully, the Lord will lead them to believe and to accept the doctrine of submission, humility and unity, even when everything does not go their way.

Again, thanks for your response.

If I were utilize the wholesale 'anything that pulls away isn't submissive' reasoning then I would venture to say that Paul wouldn't have made that break from Christian killer to New Testament writer. He broke away from the religous system he no longer could walk in agreement with.

What about others who have walked away from religious systems they could no longer agree with? Was Martin Luther lacking 'submission' to the Roman Catholic Church a bad thing?

While NOBODY believes in spiritual submission than I do I also realize that there are times that the Bible actually CONDONES certain parting of ways. Remember that whole "can two walk together except they agree" and the "house divided against itself" stuff?

I'm sorry... I'm submitted to the extreme to the spiritual authroities in my world. However, my submission is to a REAL Pastor and Elders who aren't afraid to tell me the truth. While I may respect them to the uttermost... I've never feigned a lot of deep spiritual submission to a system of elected officials who don't even know my name. To do so would eliminate the 'autonomy' of the local Church.

The United Pentecostal Church is a great organization. The greatest on the face of the Earth when it comes to promoting this precious truth. I guess that is what confuses me the most... if some of you weren't ripping on the Tulsa crew you would be ripping on the UPC. How is it now that we have so many fierce 'protectors'?

The clear conscience that I have today is a result of the fact that I'm not against EITHER group. In fact, while some of you are seeing me as a 'protector' of the Tulsa crowd, the truth is that I'm protectecting the right of both to do what they feel is right!