Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
This is from Post #122
EB has failed to prove this assertion but instead keeps resorting to logical fallacies like below.
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Interesting how you always do that to people who have an argument with you. You leave out the whole rest of my argument making it look like I'm saying that Peter NEVER prayed or EVER had faith.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
That's nice, but me....Im talking about what EB said and pointing out that if EB is right THEN PETER MUST NOT HAVE HAD FAITH AND OR PRAYED.
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Those are Praxaes' words not mine. Lets keep this discussion on track.
Peter had problems prior to Pentecost that's a fact and no strawman.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
EB resorted to a strawman argument by changing it from Peter didn't pray or have faith to "Peter didn't pray in the garden" and "Peter wasn't the Pillar of faith" he was after Pentecost. But the truth is that his assertion was tha t Peter did NOT pray and did NOT have faith.
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Praxeas I then posted the scripture.
Mat 26:40-46
"And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, COULD YOU WATCH WITH ME ONE HOUR? Watch and pray, that ye enter NOT into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, BUT THE FLESH IS WEAK. He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done. And he came and found them asleep AGAIN: for their eyes were heavy. And he left them, and went away again, and prayed the third time, saying the same words. Then cometh he to his disciples, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners. Rise, let us be going: behold, he is at hand that doth betray me."
Prior to this happening in the garden Jesus tells Peter that he would pray for Peter so that he would be strengthened. Did that mean that Jesus was praying that Peter would get physical strength? Jesus was praying for Peter's spiritual strength. Remember Peter's spirit was willing but his flesh was weak, not his physical flesh, but a spiritual condition. Peter sinks because although he had zeal (spirit) he doubted (flesh) because the winds and waves were contrary, and he doubted that he would be able to make it to Jesus. Peter was not a prayer warrior or a pillar of faith prior to Pentecost. Peter still had problems that show up and Paul withstands Peter over it.
Mat 14:24-31
"But the ship was now in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves: for the wind was contrary. And in the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea. And when the disciples saw him walking on the sea, they were troubled, saying, It is a spirit; and they cried out for fear. But straightway Jesus spake unto them, saying, Be of good cheer; it is I; be not afraid. And Peter answered him and said, Lord, if it be thou, bid me come unto thee on the water. And he said, Come. And when Peter was come down out of the ship, he walked on the water, to go to Jesus. But when he saw the wind boisterous, he was afraid; and beginning to sink, he cried, saying, Lord, SAVE ME. And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of LITTLE FAITH, wherefore didst thou DOUBT?"
Where Jesus tells Peter that Peter has "little faith" Jesus uses the Greek word ολιγόπιστος , which means "no belief", lack of trust. Jesus was teling Peter that Peter really was of no faith. Also when looking at the word "doubt" in the Greek Jesus is teling Peter that he was hesitating, pausing, not continuing in a forward motion.
Peter's whole episode of his attempt of walking on the water was more of Peter's spirit be willing and his weak flesh.
Peter had problems that needed the Holy Ghost to help him along.
Remeber Jesus tells Peter in
Luk 22:32
"But I have prayed for thee, that thy FAITH FAIL NOT: and when thou art CONVERTED, strengthen thy brethren."
Peter was water weak and Jesus warned His friend of the road that lay ahead. The words that Jesus spoke to Peter in the Greek are πίστις εκλειπω μή "faith not cease" ceasing means to discontinue. Peter did not only deny Jesus, Peter cursed Jesus.
I hope I have proven my point. Peter needed a day of Pentecost worse than the breath of life.
In Jesus name
Brother Benincasa
www.OnTimeJournal.com
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