You promised to swing by last summer for a visit but you never did!!!!!!!
Now, I'm headed back to Honduras in a few days and I may never get to see you at all.
Sorry... the high gas prices kinda took a bite out of my enthusiam to swing thru your state. Maybe this next spring- providing a financial miracle or two makes it my way. Honhuras, huh? I'd like to know what you're doing in Honduras. I'm sure you are about "the Fathers business" and I'll be praying for you. If theres anyway I can help, please let me know. Not alot I can do, but... I can do something. Kinda tired of sittin' on the bench.
"Put me in coach...
I'm ready to play... the game"
Sorry, the words to an old worldly song came to mind there. But its good to see you posting amongst us once again. I may not always agree with everything you say... but I do listen to everything you say! Keep me posted on your work in Honduras.... PM coming your way.
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"Rest in the Lord, and wait patiently for Him...." -Psa. 37:7
Waiting for the Lord is easy... Waiting patiently? Not so much.
Okay, okay, I voted. I voted Other (please explain). Now..I will explain.
I hope I will be saved. I cannot say with certainty that I am saved for this reason: I cannot judge whether or not a person is saved. That includes myself.
Satisfied?
Ditto,and it is frighting to think,...............
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DAVID A MAN AFTER GOD'S HEART.........
My only hope of salvation is in Jesus Christ, and I have hope.
But if the Bible is only legend, and Christ no more than a fine teacher, here’s my chances:
Atheism: I’m good here because I’m in the middle of a great life and there’s enough of me to fertilize the flowers when I’m gone.
Buddhism: I’ll throw my hat into the cosmic lottery, and I think that my chances of coming back as something at least as favourable as a house cat are pretty good. I could stand a decade of lying in the sun and having my belly scratched anyway.
Hinduism: With a million or so gods to check with to see if I’m on anybody’s guest list I’m sure that I’ll be able to make it in, and if not I’ll still be glad that I missed the mud (I hope it’s mud) bath in the sacred river.
Judaism: Oops!
Mormonism: I may not get to wear the sacred underwear, but at least I’ll get to spend eternity in Heaven’s basement apartment. And, that beats the Jehovah’s Witness alternative of spending eternity all ashed up in an urn. (I know ashed isn’t a word, but, hey, this is English and we’re free to make up words as needed)
Liberal Denominations: I’ve got a good shot with the Social Gospel because I’m a pretty sociable sort of guy, and I’m a shoe in for the Universalist’s Heaven.
Calvinism: I’ve got this one covered because I genuinely believed in my heart and sincerely confessed with my mouth, and neither God nor sin nor Oneness Pentecostalism is enough to keep me out.
Fundamentalism: The Catholics are probably my best chance in this category as Mary has a lot of sway, and I’ve got the kind of face that only a mother could love. My strategy for if the AMF, WPF, or UPC take charge of Heaven is to just wait until they have their first split and join which ever group will take me.
The Religious Right: If the Trinitarian Pentecostals or the Free Will Baptists are really the religious right, I’m out of luck, but at least I’ll finally be able to spend the cold months somewhere warm.
I voted 100% sure, not out of haughtiness, but out of trust in the Grace of God for Him to finish the work He has begun in me.
Sometimes, I don't feel saved.
But if I lived by my feelings, I wouldn't be saved any way!
Thanks for voting. I understand what you're saying. I guess in a case like this, the vote might have gone with what you think the odds are that God will honor your trust. It seems you are saying you have put 100% of your faith in Him, and that's fine, but a lot of folks have put their faith in the Bible's instructions for healing sickness, 100% I'm sure they would say, and yet God did not honor that faith. Now, He may have had good reasons for it, but isn't it possible He may have "good reasons" for not honoring salvation faith, when it comes to that?
One of the four core doctrines of the Assemblies of God is healing. "Divine healing is an integral part of the gospel. Deliverance from sickness is provided for in the atonement, and is the privilege of all believers." They don't seem to think it's a problem that, to their own admission in a position paper, healing doesn't always happen, but nobody will know whether their salvation (the other thing provided for in that same atonement they mention) "happened" until it is too late. I can't see how an AGer could click 100% in a poll like this!
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
My only hope of salvation is in Jesus Christ, and I have hope.
But if the Bible is only legend, and Christ no more than a fine teacher, here’s my chances:
Atheism: I’m good here because I’m in the middle of a great life and there’s enough of me to fertilize the flowers when I’m gone.
Buddhism: I’ll throw my hat into the cosmic lottery, and I think that my chances of coming back as something at least as favourable as a house cat are pretty good. I could stand a decade of lying in the sun and having my belly scratched anyway.
Hinduism: With a million or so gods to check with to see if I’m on anybody’s guest list I’m sure that I’ll be able to make it in, and if not I’ll still be glad that I missed the mud (I hope it’s mud) bath in the sacred river.
Judaism: Oops!
Mormonism: I may not get to wear the sacred underwear, but at least I’ll get to spend eternity in Heaven’s basement apartment. And, that beats the Jehovah’s Witness alternative of spending eternity all ashed up in an urn. (I know ashed isn’t a word, but, hey, this is English and we’re free to make up words as needed)
Liberal Denominations: I’ve got a good shot with the Social Gospel because I’m a pretty sociable sort of guy, and I’m a shoe in for the Universalist’s Heaven.
Calvinism: I’ve got this one covered because I genuinely believed in my heart and sincerely confessed with my mouth, and neither God nor sin nor Oneness Pentecostalism is enough to keep me out.
Fundamentalism: The Catholics are probably my best chance in this category as Mary has a lot of sway, and I’ve got the kind of face that only a mother could love. My strategy for if the AMF, WPF, or UPC take charge of Heaven is to just wait until they have their first split and join which ever group will take me.
The Religious Right: If the Trinitarian Pentecostals or the Free Will Baptists are really the religious right, I’m out of luck, but at least I’ll finally be able to spend the cold months somewhere warm.
Excellent analysis, ML!
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
Thanks for voting. I understand what you're saying. I guess in a case like this, the vote might have gone with what you think the odds are that God will honor your trust. It seems you are saying you have put 100% of your faith in Him, and that's fine, but a lot of folks have put their faith in the Bible's instructions for healing sickness, 100% I'm sure they would say, and yet God did not honor that faith. Now, He may have had good reasons for it, but isn't it possible He may have "good reasons" for not honoring salvation faith, when it comes to that?
One of the four core doctrines of the Assemblies of God is healing. "Divine healing is an integral part of the gospel. Deliverance from sickness is provided for in the atonement, and is the privilege of all believers." They don't seem to think it's a problem that, to their own admission in a position paper, healing doesn't always happen, but nobody will know whether their salvation (the other thing provided for in that same atonement they mention) "happened" until it is too late. I can't see how an AGer could click 100% in a poll like this!
It's not really about God honoring my trust, as if He owes me because I trust Him.
That's no different from the spiritual pride than can develop when someone thinks, "God has to let me go to Heaven because I have followed His 3 step plan and He has to keep His Word."
It's more like, I really don't have a shot at it, none at all, unless God is merciful to this idiot of a Christian that messes up almost daily.
God has to really love me, otherwise His patience would have dried up and I'd be dead and in hell.
That's what we all deserve, and that is why we need Jesus and His mercy.
The thing is, after all I do or don't do, I'm still only scarcely going to make it in, and that, by His Grace, not because of my doing everything right, not because of the denominal standards I've kept.
As for your ref to healing....
God is Sovereign. Ultimately, He is just and true in all His ways. All His Ways means that if I find myself in hell, it's because He let me send myself where I belong.
If I take ill and pray but am not healed, God is still just, He is glorified and I am not just sick, but sick with the hope that He may change His mind and heal me any way-- just because HE CAN. BTW, I believe that if I continually seek Him for the same thing, He will eventually honor my request-- as long as it is a good thing. I believe this!
If He doesn't, He's Sovereign.
Now all this is not so easy to type-- and I am sure much more difficult to live out.
Borrowing from the words of Michael W. Smith, "It's a test we'd all like to pass, but none of us would want to take."
But as a Christian, I don't have any other options.
My very existence depends on the Grace and Kindness of Jesus.
I need Jesus, I really need Him to be Gracious to me today, tomorrow and forever.
Jesus, I need You. Please, help me.
And I need to learn not to type too much in one response.
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"The choices we make reveal the true nature of our character."
Sorry, Jermyn, I think the 'new posts' feature missed this, so I didn't read it till you PMed. Thanks for pointing it out.
And thanks for the post.
When I say "honor your trust", I just mean that He will do what He said He would do in response. Basically, the Bible says if you do X, God will do Y. To say that He is sovereign and doesn't have to do Y if He doesn't want to is fine, and could be perfectly true, I suppose. But to say that is to say that God will not always keep His promises. Very few will admit that's what it means, but it is. (God isn't bound by human logic, they like to say!)
Regarding healing, it's exactly the same situation. God said (if the Bible is His Word) that if you do X (call for the elders etc.), I will do Y (heal). (And there's a whole thread full of healing scriptures besides James 5.) Unlike salvation, we have the luxury of finding out before we die whether He kept that promise every time. He usually does. (Whether the recovery would have happened anyway, or was helped by medication or somethign, is irrelevant. Maybe God's design simply did its job!) But sometimes He doesn't.
As you point out, perhaps God will not save everyone who thinks they've obeyed the salvation doctrine, as they understand it. Perhaps God will say No to that "prayer" (and whatever else is involved -- baptism, tongues, etc.), just like He often answers other prayers with a No, as they say.
Still, lots of people checked the 100% box. In the intro, I said this poll applies to "right now", and asked if you died right now, are you sure you'd go to Heaven. I guess not everyone thinks God say No, occasionally. At least not to some requests.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
Salvation is by faith so I believe I am saved. But that faith is only as valid as the walk behind it.
3: And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 1 John 2:3
If we are not keeping them consistently we should not assume we know him. Salvation is by faith now but is not complete till we endure to the end.
And as valid as the object of the faith, too, right? I mean, take someone with faith, in, say, Mormonism, and a good, strong walk behind it. How "valid" is that faith?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
And as valid as the object of the faith, too, right? I mean, take someone with faith, in, say, Mormonism, and a good, strong walk behind it. How "valid" is that faith?
If they are not born again they have no faith in Christ.
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