Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple
So when you had the Holy Spirit as a Charismatic believer do you feel you were not saved period? And also to me "saved" means two things.
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How I felt is of no relevance. Remission of sins is only by baptism in Jesus name. You cannot go to heaven if you still have your sin hanging around.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple
The first "saved" is INITIAL salvation. This is through faith, repentance, water baptism in Jesus name, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost.
To me if one has not done these things they are not "fully" saved. If they are walking by faith in Jesus they have begun a walk with him but not in a full way.
Thats why the UPC says the FULL STANDARD of salvation is Acts 2:38.
If one does not ULTIMATELY do what Acts 2:38 says as I said earlier I would not assure them they are born again or "saved" in the fullness of what saved means.
If one has received the baptism of the Holy Spirit it is difficult to say they are not saved at least in part because the Spirit is given as a witness to those God accepts. |
I would only identify them as having a relationship with God. I know I had one, but I still needed to follow in obedience. I suppose in same way we are saying the same thing, but our terminology is different.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple
Now the other part of "saved" is FINAL SALVATION. This is as Jesus said "he who endures to the end the same SHALL BE SAVED. Matt 24:13.
In this sense of "saved" none of us are yet "fully" saved. Many Apostolics who have been saved in INITIAL SALVATION will not wind up in Heaven. One also must be an OVERCOMER to escape Hell.
11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death. Rev. 2:11
Case in point would be that some Apostolics feel safe because they have been baptized in Jesus name and received the Holy Ghost. Yet they may walk in other false doctrines or traditions of men. They have no qualms about saying Charismatics are going to Hell because they have rejected the truth.
Yet they themselves teach much error about a number of things. So my point is that we have to keep going on with Jesus in spirit and truth. He does not allow any of us to think we can enter Heaven unless we do. |
I completely agree with you on this point. We have to continue to walk in truth, overcome, endure to the end to truly be saved.
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