Jews Against Zionism

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Originally Posted by Ferd

Brother Blume, Zionism is no more atheistic than the nation is Israel is. Israel has both religious and secular Jews. Zionism as a movement has many facets and only some are atheistic. I reject the notion that it is completely and wholly Anti-God.

Nobody said it is anti-God. It is just secular and not based upon God. That's all. The nation of Israel was started by Zionism alone.

Just as I reject the notion that America being set up as a secular Republic is somehow atheistic or displeasing to God.

Something against God is a far cry from something that is simply secular. The point is whether or not God is INTO IT. There are millions of dollars being sent to Israel for religious reasons from the USA. In fact, Christian Zionist influence is behind much of that financing, if not most of it.

And we are simply saying the root cause for Israel as a nation is not God. Not saying it is against God, although the Jews Against Zionism claim there should not be a nation of Israel there if they are not religiously adhering to God's law.

I think people do not realize that Israel was always unique. They wanted to be like other nations, in Samuel's day, and God told Samuel they rejected Him in doing so. Israel was never meant to be a nation aside from God's law-keeping. We cannot say it is similar to any other nation simply wanting to exist. God created the nation in the first place, and it is technically something that should not exist without God's influence.

I understand that Zionism started as a way to provide a homeland for Jewish people and thus protect themselves from further depredations that had occurred throughout the world. That isn't a "biblical" reason for sure. But that doesn't mean that the current nation of Israel is somehow de-legitimized because of it.

I agree in a sense. It is a nation. people have a right to be a nation if they want. But there is also the issue of God's entire purpose for it. It is like God starting the church, and then after centuries the church wishes to cast away all requirements of God involved in it, and simply be another social club among many. In some senses this is exactly what happened in some denominations. At any rate, that would be technically ridiculous.

I bristle at anything that seems to represent a political or even philosophical notion that the current nation of Israel doesn't have a right to exist, and by extension protect itself from those who would seek to harm it.

I completely disagree with bringing any harm to it! However, thinking God is involved with it when in actuality He is not, is quite another thing, and actually the point of this thread.

What is the goal here? To find some excuse for some segment of Western society to find an excuse to cease support for Israel?

I think it is to inform Christians that God is not involved in Israel today, and that if they are supporting it for religious reasons, they are wrong. Would that change people's support if they knew Israel was no different than any other country?

Christian Zionists like John Hagee are pushing support for religious reasons, thinking God is behind it. They are in grave error.

Support Israel aside from any inkling of religious reasons, if we wish! But I think many would cease if they knew God is not involved in that nation whatsoever.